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Sort by bearing length and by weight?

 
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  #8  
Old 02-01-2012, 04:55 PM
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Re: Sort by bearing length and by weight?

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Originally Posted by Mikecr View Post
I don't think bearing variance could be proven to make any difference at all.
For one, your datums aren't qualified as consistent(ogive radius, base angle).
And if your measuring base to nose, then base length would need to be accounted for differently.
Second, unless you account for each drag component, summed to contribute to BC, you could not know if bullets match in BC regardless of individual measures.
Third, without RADAR or atleast an accoustic chronograph, you cannot measure the tiny bullet engraving length affects to MV.

And as far as weight, if your bullets vary in weight enough to affect anything, you are using horrible bullets. All parameters would then be suspect so rake em into a trash can.
Pull out the wallet and buy the best bullets you can.
It was proven repeatedly ten years ago with the 300 great SMK. No other changes other than sorting by ogive cut vertical by as much as 50%.

Before sorting the 338 was not competitive. I have seen .017 variance in one box of 100 bullets.

Try it and you will not go back!
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  #9  
Old 02-01-2012, 05:04 PM
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Re: Sort by bearing length and by weight?

Mickcr, I thought about my answer and it may have been a bit harsh.

If I'm not building my own bullets, I don't have any control over the consistency of the ogive radius or the base angle. What else can I do to ensure the most consistent reloads? I thought I purchased bullets that the 7mm shooters here have had good results with. If their results haven't been good, then why are the Wildcat bullets known for being the best ones for that chambering and distance (7mm AM and 1K+), provided that they are available?

Of the items that you mentioned, what would have the most influence on group size at 1K and beyond? Would that have more influence than bearing surface or less?

Can you tell me where a person can buy measuring equipment that is cost effective for measuring the ogive and base angle when only loading 1,000 or so rounds?

I'm not a benchrest shooter, nor have I been in the long range game for very long. I'm trying to learn as fast as I can so I can shoot to the best of my ability. I figure that if I use the best components, assemble consistent ammo, have good quality equipment, then the rest is solely upon my shoulders to do the best job that I can do.
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  #10  
Old 02-01-2012, 07:07 PM
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Re: Sort by bearing length and by weight?

I do have a Buhay/Tubbs/JB comparator, and a more accurate tool of my own design. I have seen no qualified evidence of bearing variance affects to MV, only internet inferences that so far hold little basis.
I see no 'cold hard data' from anyone, and my own testing indicated no benefit with consideration of bearing variance only.
I think my input is valid as any.
Also this is not 'sorting by ogive' as that is done by a completely different tool(B.G.C and/or my mine).

On bullet weight(only), .5gr variance on a 140gr VLD might shift POI .07moa(~3/4") @ 1Kyd. Worth weighing hell that's easy enough. But variance around and beyond that(with that bullet) would make other things about the lot suspect IMO.
I don't see that much with Bergers, JLKs, Jayners, BIBs or Lapuas.
Now with big heavy .338cal bullets(like a 300smk) you could see more weight variance of coarse, but it's affect on BC would be half as much compared to same with a 140vld.

esshup, I'm not out to dissuade your efforts, and I couldn't tell you what to do, other than to consider what it is you're actually doing.
For all you know, bullets sorted to match in bearing, or weight, won't match in BC.
Which will have a larger affect downrange?
Well it's my contention that understanding this matters.
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  #11  
Old 02-02-2012, 08:52 AM
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Re: Sort by bearing length and by weight?

Have any of you ever taken a sample of bearing surface measured bullets then pushed them thru a short barrel stub and remeasured them? I'm curious if the variance remains consistent. For example, if you have three groups of 5 bullets will the bullets still be grouped the same and the bullets in each group still be equal lengths. I've got my doubts.
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Old 02-02-2012, 09:34 AM
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Re: Sort by bearing length and by weight?

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Originally Posted by Edd View Post
Have any of you ever taken a sample of bearing surface measured bullets then pushed them thru a short barrel stub and remeasured them? I'm curious if the variance remains consistent. For example, if you have three groups of 5 bullets will the bullets still be grouped the same and the bullets in each group still be equal lengths. I've got my doubts.
Pushing a bullet without the tremendous pressure associated powder ignition and the subsequent forces associated with it are much different that attempting first ensure the bullet is concentric in the bore and hammering it through to see what happens to the bullet. Yes sorting by bearing surface does work but like everything else in precision long range shooting it is only one of a host of actions that must be completed to ensure consistent results.
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  #13  
Old 02-02-2012, 09:58 AM
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Re: Sort by bearing length and by weight?

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Originally Posted by Boss Hoss View Post
Pushing a bullet without the tremendous pressure associated powder ignition and the subsequent forces associated with it are much different that attempting first ensure the bullet is concentric in the bore and hammering it through to see what happens to the bullet.
I don't remember saying anything about hammering it through. I believe the word I used was "pushed".
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  #14  
Old 02-02-2012, 09:59 AM
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Re: Sort by bearing length and by weight?

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Originally Posted by Boss Hoss View Post
Len has told me not to put cold hard data out to make people look bad..../
I am beginning to get a bit nervous here. Why would we not want cold hard data being presented, especially by some of the best and most knowledgeable on this site? What is the point if guys can't come here and learn real facts about what works vs. what is just a bunch of fluffed up opinion?

Scot E.
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