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Shoulder bump problem? Not far enough?

 
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  #1  
Old 10-18-2013, 10:20 PM
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Shoulder bump problem? Not far enough?

Hey guy's,
I am having an issue with my dies not bumping my shoulder back far enough. I'm having trouble with finding brass that will actually chamber in a new 7mm rem mag.
I'm working with brass that has been 1-3 times fired from a previous 7mm I had. I have measured a new once fired brass in the new rifle with a Hornady head-space gauge and my chamber measures out at 2.119". I've measured some factory rounds and they measure out 2.110"-114". I have multiple kinds of brass. ( fed,win, hor) I have about a 100 feds and not a one will chamber after re-sizing. I have about 50 win's and 75 hornady's and only about 25-30 % of those will chamber after re-sizing.

Dilema? why will some of the brass chamber and most not? It seems that the die is not bumping the shoulder back far enough? All the brass that fits measures under the .119" and anything over .1195" will not chamber.
I have two dies and get the same results with both. A standard RCBS FL die and a RCBS FL bushing die. Both set up as far down on the press as possible without damaging the press or the die. (screwed down touching the press at TDC plus a 1/4 turn).
I'm getting very frustrated. It's very dificult to work up a load when I cant get any consistency in my brass. All the brass has been trimmed to length and I've tried setting the dies up diferent with no change.
I have a Larry Willis collet die and I don't believe that it is a base problem.

I need help and or suggestions please

Thanks, BGG
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  #2  
Old 10-19-2013, 12:04 AM
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Re: Shoulder bump problem? Not far enough?

Given the rifle's headspace and chamber is to spec, you could try removing about .010" off the top surface of the shell holder making sure that the neck sizer has sufficient clearance to clear the shoulder. Not a problem with bushing dyes which can be backed off a bit, or the bushing removed.
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Old 10-19-2013, 08:29 AM
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Re: Shoulder bump problem? Not far enough?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Greyfox View Post
Given the rifle's headspace and chamber is to spec, you could try removing about .010" off the top surface of the shell holder making sure that the neck sizer has sufficient clearance to clear the shoulder. Not a problem with bushing dyes which can be backed off a bit, or the bushing removed.

+ one .
I normally take a few thousandths off the dye to keep from changing the shell holder because I have other dies that work perfect with it. ether way will work.

Also don't mix your brass because different brass has different spring back (Some is softer and some is harder)and the dies need to be set up for each brand.

You can use the same dies but you may have to adjust them slightly to end up with the same results.

Good luck

J E CUSTOM
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Old 10-19-2013, 11:28 AM
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Re: Shoulder bump problem? Not far enough?

Or, maybe you're screwing the die down too far.
Try backing off the die a half turn & see if you find a better path
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  #5  
Old 10-19-2013, 01:32 PM
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Re: Shoulder bump problem? Not far enough?

You have another option, get an extended shell holder from RCBS or Precision reloading in your caliber. The extended shellholder will clearance into the chamfer on the die base allowing for lots of bump or more than you'll ever need.

I myself jig all my FL resize dies upside down in a jig I made up that fits a R8 indexing fixture and I surface grind about 0.005 off the bottom of all my dies to allow for the bump, if I need it. Factory dies will all have at least a 1/16th inch 60 degree chamfer on the bottom for ease of entry of the to be sized brass so 5 thou or so is inconsequential far as sizing the case is concerned.

That way, you don't have to crank the die down on the standard shellholder and/or cam over the ram. I'm not comfortable with an interfernece fit anyway. I load lots of straight wall cases and those dies can't comtact the shellholder. If they do, the brittle carbide insert breaks.

I also use the headspace gage fron Hornady. Sound like a 0.001-0.0015 bump is all you need, attainable either will the extended shellholder and/or grinding the die base and you can grind the base on an abrasive belt if yoiu do it carefully and maintain squareness. Just be sure to measure the material removed from the base by measuring the overall length of the die as you grind the base away. A couple thou will do it. I do 5 thou as a standard so all dies are the same for my benefit.
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  #6  
Old 10-19-2013, 03:24 PM
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Re: Shoulder bump problem? Not far enough?

ORRRR...you can SHIM the casing in the shell holder to get the few thousandths bump you might need.

Sound familiar??
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  #7  
Old 10-19-2013, 03:27 PM
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Re: Shoulder bump problem? Not far enough?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SidecarFlip View Post
You have another option, get an extended shell holder from RCBS or Precision reloading in your caliber. The extended shellholder will clearance into the chamfer on the die base allowing for lots of bump or more than you'll ever need.

I myself jig all my FL resize dies upside down in a jig I made up that fits a R8 indexing fixture and I surface grind about 0.005 off the bottom of all my dies to allow for the bump, if I need it. Factory dies will all have at least a 1/16th inch 60 degree chamfer on the bottom for ease of entry of the to be sized brass so 5 thou or so is inconsequential far as sizing the case is concerned.

That way, you don't have to crank the die down on the standard shellholder and/or cam over the ram. I'm not comfortable with an interfernece fit anyway. I load lots of straight wall cases and those dies can't comtact the shellholder. If they do, the brittle carbide insert breaks.

I also use the headspace gage fron Hornady. Sound like a 0.001-0.0015 bump is all you need, attainable either will the extended shellholder and/or grinding the die base and you can grind the base on an abrasive belt if yoiu do it carefully and maintain squareness. Just be sure to measure the material removed from the base by measuring the overall length of the die as you grind the base away. A couple thou will do it. I do 5 thou as a standard so all dies are the same for my benefit.

And if you have 3 different rifles for the same caliber while the grinding off matl from the die MAY suit one rifle perfectly...if COULD "ruin" cases for another rifle.

Hence the reason I wanted REMOVABLE shims that I can use part of the time and not use for other rifles rounds!
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