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Seperating by bearing surface?

 
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  #1  
Old 09-07-2012, 09:27 PM
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Seperating by bearing surface?

How many of yal actually seperate your hunting bullets by bearring surface? I am shooting 115gr bergers from my 25-06 and find this task to be miserable. I also find I'll have half my bullets in 1 pile and the other half spread in 4 diffrent other piles. Seems like I'm loosing alot of bullets. Brad
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Old 09-07-2012, 09:42 PM
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Re: Seperating by bearing surface?

I do for my 6.5-06AI.

I was having flyers and this cured it.

I find that the issue for me was that the distance to lands is critical for this rifle more than others.

Once I had several hundred separated I had about 8 groups and 4 were obviously more significant than the others I then did measurements to the lands with each of the groups and recorded so when I load them I know exactly how far to seat them.

For the really small groupings or stacks, I use them for fireforming new brass and for fowling.
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“When a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute despotism, it is their right, it is their duty to throw off such governments. …” Jefferson

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Old 09-07-2012, 09:45 PM
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Re: Seperating by bearing surface?

Bergers I don't, the 7 shoots em better than I can shoot.................
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Old 09-08-2012, 12:51 PM
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Re: Seperating by bearing surface?

I don't.
Don't see how it would matter
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Old 09-08-2012, 01:32 PM
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Re: Seperating by bearing surface?

Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerBrad View Post
How many of yal actually seperate your hunting bullets by bearring surface? I am shooting 115gr bergers from my 25-06 and find this task to be miserable. I also find I'll have half my bullets in 1 pile and the other half spread in 4 diffrent other piles. Seems like I'm loosing alot of bullets. Brad

My question is WHY??? Dont know what you are using as a "gauge" to separate them....but if you think the same weight....same style bullet....from the same manufacture...can be separated into categories by any device you easily have hands on....compared to the bullet maker themselves ....then you go right ahead. I'll spend my time watching the Coke machine sweat at the gas station!!!!!
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Old 09-09-2012, 08:00 AM
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Re: Seperating by bearing surface?

Sully, bullet companies make them as consistent as they can, but they do not blueprint them.
They don't individually measure & separate each bullet into lots.
IMO, they should for any bullet designated 'MATCH', and of course those bullets should cost more.
This, so that a box of MATCH bullets stamped with a G1BC of .612, actually measure to a blueprint and hold a calculated G1BC of .612. Every external attribute of these bullets; End dia, Base length, Base angle, Bearing length, Bearing dia, Nose length, Ogive radius, Meplat dia, would fall within a declared tolerance -while combining to match in BC.

I seriously doubt this has ever happened, so if we're to get this we'll have to do it ourselves, and it is possible. But, the cost in it for us, is not yet viable.
A practical approach, Keyence IM-6500: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBzI...endscreen&NR=1
Adapt this to an assembly line, and automate bullet separation into lots based on software set parameters/tolerances/ final calculations. ~$25K
If I stumble into the money, I'll do it & offer true MATCH bullets on the side to recoup costs.

But what we're doing today, manually with common hard measure, only brings more questions than answers. BEARING: Why would we care at all about this single parameter? And how are we actually separating this component in measure?

With a 105LAP giving me a calculated ICAO G1BC of .495 @ 3kfps:
-If I reduce bearing by 10thou -by extending base length and nose length 5thou each(all else same), my BC changes to .497
-If I increase bearing by 10thou -by reducing base length and nose length 5thou each, my BC changes to .492
-If I reduced bearing 10thou -by extending the nose alone by 10thou, my BC changes to .498
-If I reduced bearing 10thou -by extending the base alone by 10thou, my BC changes to .496
But, nose changes can mean ogive radius change and/or meplat dia change, and every 1thou of MD on this bullet means .003 in BC adjust -by itself.

So when you lump base and bearing length together into one comparative term, and nothing else, what could it possibly mean that you would base any action on?
Let's say it's an unknown, but small BC variance. Then what does it mean as far as friction?
I have not seen a test yet to isolate a ballistic affect from bearing born friction.
Have any of you?

I know that I could not see it using 139LAPs acrossed 20' screen spacing with an Oehler.
I know that I could not see it as seating force variance using an electronic loadcell built into my Sinclair expander.
It seems like the first action anyone takes after measuring bullets is to ask on a forum about their numbers.
Well, it's my contention that nobody knows what the numbers mean(until I'm proven wrong).

It's very much like weighing brass.. Another easy shortcut leading only to assumptions in meaning..

Last edited by Mikecr; 09-09-2012 at 08:09 AM. Reason: I have no idea why this underlined
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Old 09-09-2012, 09:42 AM
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Re: Seperating by bearing surface?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikecr View Post
Sully, bullet companies make them as consistent as they can, but they do not blueprint them.
They don't individually measure & separate each bullet into lots.
IMO, they should for any bullet designated 'MATCH', and of course those bullets should cost more.
This, so that a box of MATCH bullets stamped with a G1BC of .612, actually measure to a blueprint and hold a calculated G1BC of .612. Every external attribute of these bullets; End dia, Base length, Base angle, Bearing length, Bearing dia, Nose length, Ogive radius, Meplat dia, would fall within a declared tolerance -while combining to match in BC.......

And that TOLERANCE is what Im referring to.....Its miniscule at best and what equipment does ANY individual possess that can separate the highs from the lows and retain just the nominal??? Once they were seperated...then people such as the OP whine he's tossing a lot of slugs away..!!!!

What does he assume he is going to end up with? Slugs that go into 1 hole at 500 yards or more?

Its a total waste of time..pure and simple
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