Long Range Hunting Online Magazine


Go Back   Long Range Hunting Online Magazine > Rifles, Reloading, Optics, Equipment > Reloading

Reloading Techniques For Reloading


Reply

Quoting Kirby but asking everyone.

 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 04-03-2007, 01:30 AM
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,515
Quoting Kirby but asking everyone.

I'm posting this here to avoid hyjacking another popular post. This quote comes from a discussion on different methods of fireforming brass.

[ QUOTE ]
With live fire fireforming loads, it is nearly impossible to get pressures high enough , quickly enough to prevent these pressure dents. Believe me I have tried. Even used MUCH faster powders and lighter bullets.

[/ QUOTE ]

I am constantly on the lookout for info I can apply to a dream gun I will hopefully build someday so I'm wondering, will this apply to fireforming a .280 Ackley Improved if the chamber is cut correctly so the bolt holds the parent brass forward firmly in the chamber?

I have heard that excelent groups are often possible with fire form loads and that it is common practice to develop a useable hunting load while forming a large batch of once used brass. Would it be better to cornmeal form through a scrap bbl to get good brass or would the brass turn out ok if a second sporter gun was made and have the chamber cut from the same reamer for shorter range hunting with live fire form loads?
__________________
GRAVITY. It's not just a good idea. It's the LAW!
Reply With Quote

  #2  
Old 04-03-2007, 06:35 AM
Silver Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Australia
Posts: 250
Re: Quoting Kirby but asking everyone.

I only have 2 rifles with improved chambers but have never had any problem with dents . Shoulders were rounded on my first conservative loads with my .243 Ackley but sharpened up as powder charge increased . Kirby might be referring to higher capacity cases ? Never tried the cream of wheat method as I have been able to get acceptable accuracy and velocity with fireform loads .
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 04-03-2007, 06:58 AM
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: OK
Posts: 2,145
Re: Quoting Kirby but asking everyone.

4ked, You are in luck, just go buy some Nosler brass.

They make it in 280ai so no fireforming is neccesary, the quality is excellent.

Buy 100 cases now and give a few to the smith so he can headspace acordingly.

Personally I have allways loaded the unformed case to book listed max and fireformed all my cases. Depending on the cartrige I may do 100 to 200 cases right off the bat. 100 shots will give you an idea of what the rifle likes and how it performes. Helps break in the bore nicely, so when you load formed brass for accuracy everything is smoothed out and things clean up easy. Yes accuracy with forming loads has always been very good.

At least with the 280ai this is no longer a concern.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 04-03-2007, 07:46 AM
Official LRH Sponsor
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Fort Shaw, Montana
Posts: 6,822
Re: Quoting Kirby but asking everyone.

4ked horn,

You are taking my comments WAY out of context here. That comment was on a topic about fireforming cases for my 338 Allen Magnum and not in reference to any smaller capacity wildcats.

When your dealing with a case capacity that uses up to 150 grains of powder you run into issues that you will not with any other smaller capacity cases even including those such as the Rigby and big Wby case.

When I build Improved rifles for customers, I always range test with live fireforming loads and I would say 75% of the time they meet or surpass my 1/2 moa accuracy requirement with fireforming loads.

I am also not a huge fan of fireforming 500 cases for a rifle. As such, if a rifle will be a high volume shooter, I generally recommend not to go with a wildcat unless its one that you can cold form cases for.

For a big game rifle or a dedicated long range rifle, 50 rounds of formed brass is plenty at any given time and as such is not a huge chore to form up this many cases.

Please to not think that I do not feel live fire fireforming is useful, that is certainly not the case by any means. With my huge 338 Allen Magnum however, there are issues with this type of case fireforming and corn meal forming produces a better result.

For the 280 AI you will get fine accuracy with fireforming loads if the chamber is set up properly with the correct 4 thou crush fit on the case.

Kirby Allen(50)
__________________
Kirby Allen(50)

Allen Precision Shooting
Home of the Allen Magnum, Allen Xpress and Allen Tactical Wildcats and the Painkiller Muzzle brakes.

Farther, Faster and Flatter then ever before.

Web Page: www.apsrifles.com

allenmagnum@gmail.com
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 04-03-2007, 11:48 AM
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,515
Re: Quoting Kirby but asking everyone.

[ QUOTE ]
4ked, You are in luck, just go buy some Nosler brass.
They make it in 280ai so no fireforming is neccesary, the quality is excellent.


[/ QUOTE ]
See what happens when I don't visit the LRH forums but twice in 6 months. Everybody starts sneaking in all these new products. That is good news but on the other hand I hope no one starts making the .280 AI as a factory offering in a gun. That would mean I will have to find another easy to form caliber that can't be bought at walmart. 7mm AM perhaps?
__________________
GRAVITY. It's not just a good idea. It's the LAW!
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 04-03-2007, 11:57 AM
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,515
Re: Quoting Kirby but asking everyone.

[ QUOTE ]
You are taking my comments WAY out of context here.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thats what I was wondering. Having never fireformed a thing in my life I was wondering how this all worked and how it applied to rounds like the .280. I have even considered making a hydraulic case former in the spirit of Rocky Gibbs design with a few improvements. Again, just gathering info and storing it away for that dream gun.
__________________
GRAVITY. It's not just a good idea. It's the LAW!
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 04-04-2007, 08:15 AM
Official LRH Sponsor
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Fort Shaw, Montana
Posts: 6,822
Re: Quoting Kirby but asking everyone.

Wildcat,

Contact Hornady, they are making hydro case forming dies in any chambering you want. Richard and I tested them in his 277 Allen Magnum but the Lapua case was just to stout for a die like this.

For the 280 AI however it would work much better.

As far as formed cases for the 7mm AM, I am working on it!!!

With a round like the 280 AI, I really do not mind using bullets to fireform cases. Barrel life is very long if cared for properly and accuracy is very good so you can use them in the field. A good weekend chasing chucks will get you plenty of formed cases for a 280 AI and many chucks under its belt as well!!!

With the 338 AM, its more a matter of nessesity then anything to get a quality case form.

Kirby Allen(50)
__________________
Kirby Allen(50)

Allen Precision Shooting
Home of the Allen Magnum, Allen Xpress and Allen Tactical Wildcats and the Painkiller Muzzle brakes.

Farther, Faster and Flatter then ever before.

Web Page: www.apsrifles.com

allenmagnum@gmail.com
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes


Similar Threads for: Quoting Kirby but asking everyone.
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
New Rig From Kirby buzz4me2 Long Range Hunting & Shooting 14 07-27-2009 06:58 PM
Thank You Kirby! esshup Long Range Hunting & Shooting 18 07-01-2008 09:20 PM
kirby.... remingtonman_25_06 General Discussion 9 05-16-2006 09:39 PM
Kirby, 22 AM ? dr14 Rifles, Bullets, Barrels and Ballistics 20 09-19-2005 10:13 AM
Kirby Mayhem338 Rifles, Bullets, Barrels and Ballistics 5 07-05-2005 11:35 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:22 AM.


Powered by vBulletin ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Management Powered by vBadvanced CMPS
All content ©2010-2014 Long Range Hunting, LLC