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primer seating question

 
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  #1  
Old 02-01-2014, 10:47 PM
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Join Date: May 2013
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primer seating question

I'm loading some 22-250 with new Norma brass and Remington LR primers. I used a Sinclair primer pocket uniformer before loading the brass. I checked the pocket depths after running the uniformer on them and they were just above SAAMI min specs.
Now when I seat some of the primers with a Hornady hand primer until I feel it stop, ie primer is at the bottom of the pocket, some stick out past the end of the case. I have to give them just a little more pressure to get them just below the case (.001"). When I do this, apparently it puts a little bulge in the end of the case. When I measure some of the loaded rounds from the end of the case to the ogive with a bullet comparator on a caliper, I get more than a dummy round with no primer installed.
I'm loading these for a bolt rifle, not an automatic.

So my question is: A) is it better to leave the primer stick a little past the end of the case and not cause any bulging or B) put a little more pressure on the primer to get it seated just below the case and cause some bulging?
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  #2  
Old 02-01-2014, 11:04 PM
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Re: primer seating question

The top of the primer should be below the head of the case, no matter auto or not. Usually, after using a primer pocket uniformer, they are a couple thou lower than without a using a uniformer.

What is bulging after seating further in? The primer itself? Some primers and brass can have a tight fit and if the primer is a softer one, the top of it will flatten a little. No big deal.

Also, Hornady primer seaters come with two different trays, a green and a back one. The green is used with RCBS shell holders and the black is for Hornady shell holders. It can make a difference in how deep the primers seat.

Can you post a pic?
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  #3  
Old 02-01-2014, 11:14 PM
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Re: primer seating question

If you have uniformed the pocket depth then the seating should be fairly easy and not above the base of the case . My guess is you have not cleaned the uniformer cutting flutes enough and it is not getting right down.
It will stop cutting when it loads up with chips . So clean it off with a tooth brush and do it again . I think it will cut down some more . Keep doing that until it will not cut anymore at all. I like my primers level or just below the head and seated all the way home .
If you are bulging the head any , you are using too much force .
A bad sloppy shell holder could be causing the rim to be poorly supported .
Norma brass is usually good quality .
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  #4  
Old 02-01-2014, 11:57 PM
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Re: primer seating question

Quote:
Originally Posted by Barrelnut View Post
What is bulging after seating further in? The primer itself? Some primers and brass can have a tight fit and if the primer is a softer one, the top of it will flatten a little. No big deal.

Also, Hornady primer seaters come with two different trays, a green and a back one. The green is used with RCBS shell holders and the black is for Hornady shell holders. It can make a difference in how deep the primers seat.

Can you post a pic?
The primers are a tight fit in the new brass. The case head is apparently bulging, not the primer. The primer doesn't stick past the end of the case head. On some cases when I seat the bullet, the case head to ogive is longer than on a case with no primer.

I don't think I could get a picture of a primer that is .001 or .002 above the case head. I also don't think I could get a picture of a small bulge resulting in .005 longer case length.
I am using the green tray with an RCBS shell holder.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bullet bumper View Post
If you have uniformed the pocket depth then the seating should be fairly easy and not above the base of the case . My guess is you have not cleaned the uniformer cutting flutes enough and it is not getting right down.
It will stop cutting when it loads up with chips . So clean it off with a tooth brush and do it again . I think it will cut down some more . Keep doing that until it will not cut anymore at all. I like my primers level or just below the head and seated all the way home .
If you are bulging the head any , you are using too much force .
A bad sloppy shell holder could be causing the rim to be poorly supported .
Norma brass is usually good quality .
The pocket uniformer is clean. I clean it every time I use it.
A bad sloppy shell holder is a thought. I have another one I'll try. Thanks.
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  #5  
Old 02-02-2014, 03:21 AM
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Re: primer seating question

Quote:
Originally Posted by dmax1800 View Post
The primers are a tight fit in the new brass. The case head is apparently bulging, not the primer. The primer doesn't stick past the end of the case head. On some cases when I seat the bullet, the case head to ogive is longer than on a case with no primer.

I don't think I could get a picture of a primer that is .001 or .002 above the case head. I also don't think I could get a picture of a small bulge resulting in .005 longer case length.
I am using the green tray with an RCBS shell holder.



The pocket uniformer is clean. I clean it every time I use it.
A bad sloppy shell holder is a thought. I have another one I'll try. Thanks.
I cannot see how the case head can 'bulge' from seating a primer, it's not possible as far as I am aware. I believe the primer is high and giving you a false reading.
All primers are designed to not only bottom out in the primer pocket, but also to push the anvil into the cup until it is also flush with the bottom of the cup, this gives the priming mix a slight pre ignition squish and sets up the primer to take the full hit from the firing pin, if it isn't flush, some of the firing pin energy is absorbed by the primer being seated further into the cup, it is necessary for the primer to be seated .003"-.005" below flush for the above factors to be present.
Some primer and case combo's are just harder to seat, if the primer is still high you will have to reseat it until it is below flush.
I have this problem with Norma cases and Federal primers, but Winchester primers don't seat as hard and bottom out without having to use excessive force.

Cheers.
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  #6  
Old 02-02-2014, 04:41 AM
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Join Date: May 2009
Location: Australia
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Re: primer seating question

Quote:
Originally Posted by dmax1800 View Post
The primers are a tight fit in the new brass. The case head is apparently bulging, not the primer. The primer doesn't stick past the end of the case head. On some cases when I seat the bullet, the case head to ogive is longer than on a case with no primer.

I don't think I could get a picture of a primer that is .001 or .002 above the case head. I also don't think I could get a picture of a small bulge resulting in .005 longer case length.
I am using the green tray with an RCBS shell holder.



The pocket uniformer is clean. I clean it every time I use it.
A bad sloppy shell holder is a thought. I have another one I'll try. Thanks.
You have to clean the chips several times as you use it otherwise it does not cut all the way down . Is the uniformer a fixed depth type or adjustable depth type ? Some times heavily stamped case heads can have a rough edge to the lettering that stops the uniformer cutting all the way down to the correct level.
Rub the case heads lightly on a flat sharpening stone just to see what sticks up . I still think you are not persisting long enough with the cutter .
Make sure the cutter is cleaning out right to the corner of the pocket .
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  #7  
Old 02-02-2014, 05:03 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Tucson Az
Posts: 1,267
Re: primer seating question

You are not the first person mentioning primer seating issues with Norma brass. I have encountered this too.

I use a variable speed drill adjusted for low RPM and make two or three passes cleaning chips with each pass. On some cases the sides were so tight I couldn't get the pocket uniformer to cut easily. A tiny bit of water placed on the cutter's outside lubes enough to get the pocket cut deep enough.

I found that my old uniformer didn't do the job and purchased a new RCBS uniformer which works much better. Maybe you need to switch cutters.
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