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Lee Collet Dies vs Redding S bushing dies

 
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  #15  
Old 06-04-2006, 01:38 PM
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Re: Lee Collet Dies vs Redding S bushing dies

[ QUOTE ]
I also like the the Lee Collet dies. I also have a couple rifles that need to be ran through a FL die after ever firing. My question is could Lee or any other die manf. build a collet die that could FL the brass? That would great!!! Moe

[/ QUOTE ]

For each caliber I load for I have a box with 4 dies in it.

Lee Collet Neck Sizer
Redding Body Die
RCBS Competition Seater
Lee Factory Crimp Die

When the cases get tight on about the 3rd or 4th loading, I use the Redding Body Die to PFLR and push the shoulder back .001". The body die will have to be used for each successive reloading on those cases. Works great for me and I have not noticed any difference in accuracy between PFLR and neck sizing.

Along with a thorough steel wooling of the inside of the necks after sizing, I feel like the Lee Collet and the Lee Factory Crimp (light crimp only) lead to consistant bullet release. Just my way of doing it.

Also, on some long necked cases like the 30-06 or 270 I put a washer around the case on top of the shell holder when using the Lee Collet Die. This leaves a portion of the neck - that is the thickness of the washer - fire formed to the chamber and centers the neck by contact. Seems to reduce brass life though.
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  #16  
Old 06-04-2006, 03:16 PM
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Re: Lee Collet Dies vs Redding S bushing dies

woods, what kind of runout do you have on your bullets, once they have been seated in your cases?
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  #17  
Old 06-04-2006, 03:38 PM
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Re: Lee Collet Dies vs Redding S bushing dies

[ QUOTE ]
woods, what kind of runout do you have on your bullets, once they have been seated in your cases?

[/ QUOTE ]

I did an OCW sequence on a batch of 300 win mag case using H1000 and the 200 gr Accubond recently. These cases were Norma, outside neck turned, PFLR with the body die, Lee Collet Neck sized. The runout <font color="red"> on the bullet </font> just before the ogive started was:

1ea @ .0000" (needle didn't move)
2ea @ .0005"
7ea @ .001"
3ea @ .0015"
4ea @ .002"
1ea @ .0025"

Without outside neck turning, it depends on the type of brass. With Norma which I normally use I get a consistant .0015" to .002" <font color="red"> on the case </font> with the Lee Collet without the neck turning.

IMO, once you get rid of all the .005" plus runouts like you get with a FL die, then improvements in accuracy are hard to define.

I have one Redding Type S Bushing Style Neck Sizing Die, but it yielded a consistant .007" runout on the case. Went back immediately to the Lee Collet and haven't tried any more of them. Maybe I got a bad one.
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  #18  
Old 07-04-2010, 08:19 AM
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Re: Lee Collet Dies vs Redding S bushing dies

CP

I have to take issue with your tone here. You seem hell bent on Redding Dies no matter what.

All of the positive points stated here about Lee Collet Dies I wholeheartedly agree with. While I appreciate the quality of the Redding dies, (I own several,) when it comes to the Lee Collet Die they simply work and work well.

The Redding bushing dies transfer bad runout to the inside diameter of the case neck, while the Lee Collet Die places the lack of concentricity to the outside and leaves the inside diameter a mirror image of the mandrel, which has no runout.

I have a 20 year old Ruger bolt gun in 30-06 with the only modifications being reduced trigger pull and a glass bedding job. After discovering the collet die, this gun became a boringly consistent 3/4 minute of angle shooter. It is a bit of an effort to remove all of the copper fouling but in the woods it's a whitetail's worst nightmare.
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  #19  
Old 07-04-2010, 09:59 AM
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Re: Lee Collet Dies vs Redding S bushing dies

Hey highflyer, welcome to LRH

Don't know if Centre Punch is still around after 4 years and he may have changed his mind in that time. I know I hate it when I prove myself wrong but I have changed my mind about some things with time. Not the Lee Collets though.

I'm sure he meant no offense. Here at Long Range Hunting is where I come to get away from internet brawls and there is nowhere else you can get the depth of case prep knowledge. But it takes all kinds of information and opinions to hash out an issue.
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  #20  
Old 07-04-2010, 10:26 AM
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Re: Lee Collet Dies vs Redding S bushing dies

I have a Sinclair concentricity gauge.
I did some comparisons of various .223 dies I had, using a different population of 22 cases selected at random for each die. Here is the raw data:

Quote:
Quantity of 22 Brass LC93 cases fired in unknown AR15
Brass vibrate cleaned
Neck size and decap in Lee Collet
Size in Forster FL with .246" honed neck
Brass trimmed to 1.750", and chamfered
60 gr HNDY TAP .224 soft point moly bullet, 25 gr Bulk Surplus IMR4895 [acts like H322]
Seated with Forster Ultra Micrometer Seater Die 2.26" OAL
average run out = .00094"

Quantity of 22 Brass LC93 cases fired in unknown AR15
Brass vibrate cleaned
Size in Forster FL with .246" honed neck
Neck size and decap in Lee Collet
Brass trimmed to 1.750", and chamfered
60 gr HNDY TAP .224 soft point moly bullet, 25 gr Bulk Surplus IMR4895 [acts like H322]
Seated with Forster Ultra Micrometer Seater Die 2.26" OAL
average run out = .00107"


Quantity of 22 Brass LC93 cases fired in unknown AR15
Brass vibrate cleaned
Size in Forster FL with .246" honed neck
Lee decapping die
Brass trimmed to 1.750", and chamfered
60 gr HNDY TAP .224 soft point moly bullet, 25 gr Bulk Surplus IMR4895 [acts like H322]
Seated with Forster Ultra Micrometer Seater Die 2.26" OAL
average run out = .00096"
5/22 had loose necks, slip fit on .224" bullet, bullet held by neck base donut


Quantity of 22 Brass LC93 cases fired in unknown AR15
Brass vibrate cleaned
Size in Redding "S" FL with .246" bushing
Lee decapping die
Brass trimmed to 1.750", and chamfered
60 gr HNDY TAP .224 soft point moly bullet, 25 gr Bulk Surplus IMR4895 [acts like H322]
Seated with Forster Ultra Micrometer Seater Die 2.26" OAL
average run out = .00116"
Some problems with hard to trim
I concluded that I should stop using the Redding S die, and use the Lee Collet die that had been lying around my reloading room gathering dust for years. Not because of the small improvement in run out, but because it was easier to use and the case length growth problem, with high pressure loads, was much better.
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  #21  
Old 07-04-2010, 05:17 PM
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Re: Lee Collet Dies vs Redding S bushing dies

Quote:
Originally Posted by woods View Post
Hey highflyer, welcome to LRH

Don't know if Centre Punch is still around after 4 years and he may have changed his mind in that time. I know I hate it when I prove myself wrong but I have changed my mind about some things with time. Not the Lee Collets though.

I'm sure he meant no offense. Here at Long Range Hunting is where I come to get away from internet brawls and there is nowhere else you can get the depth of case prep knowledge. But it takes all kinds of information and opinions to hash out an issue.
I did not check the date on the post. Ancient history huh? I certainly meant no disrespect, i'm just a fan of the Lee Collet dies. You've got a good site here with great information.
Mike
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