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Ladder testing at 1k- Detailed article and video

 
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  #22  
Old 04-27-2014, 09:15 PM
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Location: Mouth of Hobble Crk Canyon, Utah
Posts: 623
Re: Ladder testing at 1k- Detailed article and video

Joden,

I'm soon to start loading for the 338 Edge and I'm able to set the 300 RUM cases in, neck up, in the MTM-100-Mag box.

Handled Deluxe Rifle Ammo boxes by MTM Case-Gardô - 100 Plastic handled ammunition reloading boxes and cartridge cases

Does the 30-378 case fit that box? If it won't you might consider placing your cases, neck up, in our loading block and VERY carefully transport it to the range. Maybe wrap some plastic around the tray so it sits tight over the case mouths and prevents some powder from popping out.

300 works in a pinch but to be honest, if it's custom rifle that will likely be VERY accurate, 300 may have a hard time differentiating the holes. An average accuracy rifle will likely work well at 300. Any time you can get further out, it will make life easier. A local shooter, Curtis, tried this method a few months back and he was happier than a pig in s**t. Took him 32 rounds to find and verify the node.

Alan
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  #23  
Old 04-27-2014, 11:44 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 131
Re: Ladder testing at 1k- Detailed article and video

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Griffith View Post
Joden,

I'm soon to start loading for the 338 Edge and I'm able to set the 300 RUM cases in, neck up, in the MTM-100-Mag box.

Handled Deluxe Rifle Ammo boxes by MTM Case-Gardô - 100 Plastic handled ammunition reloading boxes and cartridge cases

Does the 30-378 case fit that box? If it won't you might consider placing your cases, neck up, in our loading block and VERY carefully transport it to the range. Maybe wrap some plastic around the tray so it sits tight over the case mouths and prevents some powder from popping out.

300 works in a pinch but to be honest, if it's custom rifle that will likely be VERY accurate, 300 may have a hard time differentiating the holes. An average accuracy rifle will likely work well at 300. Any time you can get further out, it will make life easier. A local shooter, Curtis, tried this method a few months back and he was happier than a pig in s**t. Took him 32 rounds to find and verify the node.

Alan
Don't know if my cases fit the MTM box, don't know how much larger they are than the 300, Midway says they fit 30-378 face down, Instead I took a ammo can from work and punched holes in a foam insert. Maybe Ill have to send MTM a round and have them make a box that fits face up. Thanks for the advice on distance to conduct ladder test. To be honest I wanted to do it closer so I could get away with using my night force (8x32 [as I don't have spotting scope yet]) as the spotting scope and not have to make the targets that you made in order to see hits tat far away. Would a cardboard painted white flake the paint off when a round goes through or does it have to be black plastic?

Joden
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  #24  
Old 04-28-2014, 12:07 AM
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Location: Mouth of Hobble Crk Canyon, Utah
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Re: Ladder testing at 1k- Detailed article and video

30 cal holes? You'll be able to see them at 32x; even at 400, 500 or 600 yds. Haven't tested it but my SWAG says the paint will stick to the cardboard and "won't" chip/peel off. You need that contrasting color to clearly see the holes at distance.

Alan
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  #25  
Old 04-28-2014, 12:25 AM
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Re: Ladder testing at 1k- Detailed article and video

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Originally Posted by Alan Griffith View Post
30 cal holes? You'll be able to see them at 32x; even at 400, 500 or 600 yds. Haven't tested it but my SWAG says the paint will stick to the cardboard and "won't" chip/peel off. You need that contrasting color to clearly see the holes at distance.

Alan
Sweet, Thanks Alan
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  #26  
Old 05-01-2014, 10:42 PM
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Re: Ladder testing at 1k- Detailed article and video

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Originally Posted by Alan Griffith View Post
When it comes to wind, in this type of testing, I don't care if it's blowing 10 mph. I want it from a consistent direction. One of the beauties of shooting out in the West Utah desert is you can usually find about any (BLM) place to shoot so you can set up your direction so that you have a consistent wind, left or right, but not switchy from 11-1 or 5-6. If my groups are blown out a bit horizontally, so be it. That these distances I'm looking for as small a vertical as possible because at much further distances, it's vertical spreading that will eat you up.

Alan
Alan,
In regards to the ladder test, do you run a bore snake through the barrel between ladders to keep velocities even or should I not touch the barrel until after all three ladders are shot? Also, if I do clean is a bore snake bad for the barrel to use considering it's dry and has brass brush at the beginning of it?

Thanks
Joden
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  #27  
Old 05-02-2014, 12:49 AM
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Location: Mouth of Hobble Crk Canyon, Utah
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Re: Ladder testing at 1k- Detailed article and video

Joden,

I'm in the camp that doesn't clean a barrel except for a very few specific reasons. 1) Barrel break in. 2) The barrel is wet and needs to be cleaned and dried out. 3) Accuracy starts to fall off and could be attributed to copper fouling and/or maybe a carbon ring just past the throat.

I Dyna Bore Coat my barrels then break them in per the Krieger method on their web site. Personal decision but it has worked for me. I then don't touch my barrels unless numbers 2 or 3 occurs and it hasn't. I can get away with it because in our dry Utah air we don't worry about high humidity and barrel moisture. I've got two 6.5x47's (Krieger and Broughton barrels) that haven't been cleaned in close to 2000 rounds each and they still putting 5-shots into .25 to .3 moa.

Once a barrel has been cleaned it could take as little as 5 or as many as 50 rounds to get the barrel properly fouled and accuracy returns. The DBC really negates or may even totally eliminate copper fouling. I have a 4th reason to clean a barrel. I have a custom Pre 64 M70 in 9.3x62 using a Pacnor barrel. It's an absolute tac driver putting many 3-shot groups in around .15 to .25 moa. I've been casting and shooting lead bullets. Before one does that you've got to get all the copper fouling out before shooting lead. When I went to clean the barrel that had about 500 rounds down it, I got ZERO copper out using Barnes CR10. DBC really works!

Alan

Alan
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  #28  
Old 05-02-2014, 02:30 AM
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Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 131
Re: Ladder testing at 1k- Detailed article and video

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Griffith View Post
Joden,

I'm in the camp that doesn't clean a barrel except for a very few specific reasons. 1) Barrel break in. 2) The barrel is wet and needs to be cleaned and dried out. 3) Accuracy starts to fall off and could be attributed to copper fouling and/or maybe a carbon ring just past the throat.

I Dyna Bore Coat my barrels then break them in per the Krieger method on their web site. Personal decision but it has worked for me. I then don't touch my barrels unless numbers 2 or 3 occurs and it hasn't. I can get away with it because in our dry Utah air we don't worry about high humidity and barrel moisture. I've got two 6.5x47's (Krieger and Broughton barrels) that haven't been cleaned in close to 2000 rounds each and they still putting 5-shots into .25 to .3 moa.

Once a barrel has been cleaned it could take as little as 5 or as many as 50 rounds to get the barrel properly fouled and accuracy returns. The DBC really negates or may even totally eliminate copper fouling. I have a 4th reason to clean a barrel. I have a custom Pre 64 M70 in 9.3x62 using a Pacnor barrel. It's an absolute tac driver putting many 3-shot groups in around .15 to .25 moa. I've been casting and shooting lead bullets. Before one does that you've got to get all the copper fouling out before shooting lead. When I went to clean the barrel that had about 500 rounds down it, I got ZERO copper out using Barnes CR10. DBC really works!

Alan

Alan
I'm used to cleaning after every shooting session. Maybe I'm over doing it. My gun was made by GAPrecision and they use Bartlein Barrels. The cleaning instructions that Gaprecision gave me with the gun say to clean at normal intervals of every 10-25 rounds after initial barrel break in. Your thoughts?

2 questions

1) When you say you don't clean are you referring to copper clean or are you saying you never run a patch down the barrel period because the DBC works so well?

2) During the ladder test, I assume you don't touch the barrel then? Assuming I did a good job with barrel break in, will I see pressure and velocity rise during 30-40 rounds of shooting the ladder test to a point where the data isn't sufficient to trust?

Thanks
Joden
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