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Reloading Berger Bullets


Help my Dads recipe

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Unread 05-26-2008, 08:44 AM
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 362
Help my Dads recipe

I am taking my father on his first elk trip this Nov. He used to be a very serious and avid reloader back in the late 70s and developed a load for his 7mm weathery mag, consisting of 162grn Hornandy bthp match bc=.534, using 57 grns Imr 4350 and cci magnum 250 primers. Oal=3.360 .The rifle is a 1970s model Weatherby Mark 5, 1:10 twist with there smallest diameter sporter barrel..26 inch. It grouped in the .5-.75 @100yds.His only concern was the watermelon sized hole it left in the one and only deer he took with this particular load. I happen to like that idea just don't shoot the shoulder direct.

Any how he still has 50 of these bullets and we reset up his work station today for him. Anyone have a close number on Mv( he never chronod, to poor back in the 70s) at @4000 elev 50% humidity and 50 degrees f? We want to develop a drop chart out to 800 for him.
Also anyone used a similar set up on elk and muleys?
Kind Regards
Lowcountry Wildlife Management
Knowing Wildlife Beyond Science
Genesis 9;2
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Unread 05-26-2008, 09:33 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 54
Bullet choice!

I would change your choice of bullets in your recipie use a premium hunting bullet that is designed for elk size game,I don't think a BTHP match bullet is a good choice for heavy boned elk! A better choice would be ,Nosler Accubonds, Etips,or Barnes TTSX's! Have fun on your hunt!!
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Unread 05-26-2008, 09:54 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Blackfoot, Idaho
Posts: 8,876

That bullet must be chugging along as 58gr IMR 4350 in a my 270 Win and a 140 gr bullet produces 3190 so I'd "guess" that with the extra weight and diameter and a self generated fudge factor the 162 is right around 3000.

If a chrono is needed I can ship you a loaner. And it works. In fact I'm going to use it today for a experiment I'm working on.

I really like those pencil barrelled weatherbys. Shot one in 300 and one in 240 for what was then long range chucks. Pretty sweet.

BTW, take the shot just behind the should joint and hope a small branch is hit about a foot before the animal. Nothing better on an elk than a watermellon sized hole on both sides;) Just don't hit the good meat.:o
I may be the slowest guy on the mountain . . . . but . . . . I'm on the mountain!

Last edited by royinidaho; 05-26-2008 at 10:07 AM.
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Unread 05-26-2008, 10:20 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Potters Hill, NC
Posts: 1,726
Using the 160gn Partition and/or AccuBond the Nosler Reloading Guide #6 has;
60.0 = 2858fps (78%),
62.0 = 2943fps (81%),
64.0 = 3028fps (84%).
I guess it's OK to go below the minimum powder listing. Never done that before. I have on occasion gone over the listed max. JohnnyK.
"The only thing necessay for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing."
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Unread 05-26-2008, 02:53 PM
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Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Potomac River
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Acklyfan gave you good advice. JohnnyK gave you relevant data I simply do not understand why some people run their mouth about stuff they don't know anything about. Advising a person to use this bullet on elk is unbelievably bad advice.

I was shooting a 7mm Wby in the 1970s using IMR4350, Rem 9 1/2Ms and the Hornady 162HPBT match bullet which actually has a BC of 0.625. I ran nearly 20% more powder in the case and the primers would flow into the starting lip of the pocket.

In 1979 I ran a number of penetration tests in newspaper comparing the 162 HPBT to the 168 Sierra MK and the 160 Nosler partition. It was the first time in my life I had performed penetration tests and I recorded the results but had little knowledge of their real meaning. I learned their true meaning after having shot two animals.

The first animal I shot was a spike elk at 1100 yards. The bullet landed on his shoulder blade and did not break it. It simply made a little puff of dust on his shoulder blade and I watched as he trotted across 300 yards of clearing. We tracked him the next morning and the bullet simply never made it into his chest cavity and he never died. This was not even a big spike elk but just a little one and the bullet would not break the shoulder blade nor go through it.

Two weeks later I set up with my friend to kill a mule deer at long range but they appeared right under our ledge at 50 yards. We each fired at a buck and I hit a 3X3 right in the shoulder blade and the bullet created a watermelon sized crater on the shoulder blade but did not get into the chest cavity and the deer got up and ran off. After a half a mile of tracking my friend spotted it and killed it on the run with his 7 Rem mag and a 140 gr Speer BT.

My experience with this particular bullet is just the same as your Dad's. It is extremely explosive and has no ability to penetrate and break bones. It is remarkably accurate and that lures you into shooting it. Most likely your Dad backed the load down low to get a reduced speed at which the bullet did not explode on the hide. You are probably in the 2700 fps range of velocity. I was running about 3100 to 3200 fps. Get a better bullet. And I believe I already told you once not to be contradicting your Dad because he has a lot of good sense. What have you gotten him for fathers day?

Go with something like the 180 Berger which has good sectional density.

Take the 50 bullet left and offer them for sale. The Pa longrange whitetail hunters like them because they work well on a little chihuahua sized whitetails we hunt which have fragile bones.
The Smokin Fur Rifle Club
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Unread 05-26-2008, 04:09 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Blackfoot, Idaho
Posts: 8,876
Oh Well. Some days chickens. Some days feathers.

However, I do think that if you put your shot, even with that suspect bullet in the number one spot, on the animal it should do at least what a 223, 70 gr bullet launched at 2600 did and that's kill the elk. Although the shot was only 120 yards.

Seeing as how the option for other bullets has been opened why not consider a different cartridge say something in 338 Weatherby or some such. Then the high shoulder shot may be more appropriate.;)

I may be the slowest guy on the mountain . . . . but . . . . I'm on the mountain!
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Unread 05-26-2008, 04:15 PM
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Join Date: Jun 2004
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At the velocity your Dad will be at with his 7mm Wby, I would say the 160 gr Accubond may be the perfect bullet for his rifle for anything up to elk. At close range, the heavy jacket and bonded core will generally outpenetrate the Partition of same weight and caliber. I have seen this in several calibers and bullet weights and in every case, the Accubond penetrated better.

Also, they generally shoot more accurate then the partition. THey will also have less drop and less wind drift.

At long range where velocity has dropped off, the tip on the Accubond will initate expansion MUCH more reliably then any non tipped bullet, even soft points.

In my opinion, seeing how the Accubonds perform, they pretty much make the parition obsolete in many aspects. That is if your rifle likes them. They are this good and for less money then the Paritions.

Other premium bullets such as the TSX and those from Swift will also work well but they have issues that the Accubond does not have. For all around use, I could think of no better bullet then the 160 gr Accubond in your Dads rifle.

Kirby Allen(50)
Kirby Allen(50)

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