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Flattened Primers...

 
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  #1  
Old 07-28-2013, 07:32 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 29
Flattened Primers...

So I just started reloading, and went out this morning to test out some loads and try to find my max load. I guess I will list out the components I am using and the processes I used to load them.

Stock Stevens 200 308 Win.

Winchester once fired brass
CCI 250 Primer, only primers I could find and my friend checked his Speer book and they called for a magnum primer for 2520
Accurate 2520 powder
Sierra 165 Grain Game King Soft Point Boat Tail
Neck tension on the ones I measured appeared to be .002"

Full length resized and deprimed using Hornady spray lube
Trimmed to 2.006", Chamferred and deburred
Tumbled in crushed walnut and nu polish and a touch of mineral spirits
Charged to exact by hand with a scale and a trickler
Bullets seated to .020" off the lands, No crimp

So I went and shot some this morning and got flattening primers way before I expected. I am using the Lee 2nd edition book, and they show a minimum load of 42.9 grains and a max of 47.7, so I started at 43 and increased in .5 grain increments. 43 grains shows no primer deformation, 43.5 I could tell the primer changed a bit but just barely, and 44 grains I got a flattened out primer...

43 Grains


43.5 Grains, Inconsistent flattening



44 Grains, flat...


I don't have any ejector indenting or stiff bolt lift, the only other thing I can see is a mark where the ejector appears to scrape on the head maybe when lifting the bolt? Picture #3 kinda shows it. Is this something I need to watch for as well?

So at what point do you start backing off? I felt like the 43.5 grain is probably the max. It just seems weird that I am getting pressure signs a half grain above minimum. I will probably load up 10 rounds each of some lower charges to try for accuracy but then I will be under the book minimum... I have since found some CCI 200 primers, should I try them and see how it goes? Just looking for ideas, again I am totally new to this so I just want to make sure I am being safe and gonna get the best BANG for my efforts. Thanks in advance for your guys' consideration.

Edit, I did do a search and found alot of bickering back and forth about things that are far beyond my realm of understanding at this point in the game. I am just looking to find out what you guys would do. Keep going? Stop there and shoot some groups? Switch powders and start over?
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Old 07-28-2013, 07:51 PM
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Join Date: May 2012
Location: N.D.
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Re: Flattened Primers...

Well, from what my accurate data from 2005 says you are at the top charge at 44 grains roughly. For a 308 win with a 168 and 2520 and a cci200 they start at 40.5 and land at a top of 45.0. Kick it down a grain or so for a mag. primer and 44 it is. BTW. they are using the sierra 168 match at 2.800" oal.
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Old 07-28-2013, 07:58 PM
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Location: Alabama
Posts: 5,891
Re: Flattened Primers...

I run 44.0gr of Varget in my .308 with 168 & 175gr bullets. No flattened primers.

I had my first flattened primers today at the range. Apparantly my new 7mm STW load for the Berger 180 VLD's is a little bit too hot. Primers are pancaking and the bolt is sticking and won't slide back. Guess I need to back it down a grain or so.

My primers are flattening on my STW 168 VLD load, but nowhere near as bad, and the bolt is not sticky, and it's shooting 1/2 MOA 3-shot groups. Guess I'll keep that load.
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Old 07-28-2013, 08:05 PM
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Re: Flattened Primers...

Quote:
Originally Posted by therichardpowell View Post
Edit, I did do a search and found alot of bickering back and forth about things that are far beyond my realm of understanding at this point in the game. I am just looking to find out what you guys would do. Keep going? Stop there and shoot some groups? Switch powders and start over?
When it really comes down to it it doesn't mean squat what the pressure is if she won't shoot well. Safety is damn important but she's gotta shoot too.
As far as the little things done to seating or brass to tweak a load, most factory pipes can't tell the difference. I don't personally do a damn thing that doesn't substantively add to the accuracy capability of my ammo. Whittling on your brass can add a lot of time and gets a lot less benefit that simply sizing, trimming, and cleaning/ inspecting your brass. Finding a bullet and powder your barrel likes will make all the difference.

What is your load shooting like at present?? Is there any hope of accuracy??
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Old 07-28-2013, 08:14 PM
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Re: Flattened Primers...

Quote:
Originally Posted by MudRunner2005 View Post
I run 44.0gr of Varget in my .308 with 168 & 175gr bullets. No flattened primers.

I had my first flattened primers today at the range. Apparantly my new 7mm STW load for the Berger 180 VLD's is a little bit too hot. Primers are pancaking and the bolt is sticking and won't slide back. Guess I need to back it down a grain or so.

My primers are flattening on my STW 168 VLD load, but nowhere near as bad, and the bolt is not sticky, and it's shooting 1/2 MOA 3-shot groups. Guess I'll keep that load.
Muddy, I think you've gotta step back a bit more than that on your 7stw if she's sticky. Here's a pressure graph you've seen before from my old sendero 7stw; the win 150 grain load hit over 70 Kpsi peak and she didn't have heavy bolt lift. I'd go 3 to 5 percent down on charge as your pressure should fall twice as fast as the charge drop.

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  #6  
Old 07-28-2013, 08:15 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 29
Re: Flattened Primers...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lefty7mmstw View Post
Well, from what my accurate data from 2005 says you are at the top charge at 44 grains roughly. For a 308 win with a 168 and 2520 and a cci200 they start at 40.5 and land at a top of 45.0. Kick it down a grain or so for a mag. primer and 44 it is. BTW. they are using the sierra 168 match at 2.800" oal.
That is good info, thanks. I checked their load data online and it is copied and pasted right out of my Lee manual, not very helpful...
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  #7  
Old 07-28-2013, 08:24 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2012
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Re: Flattened Primers...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lefty7mmstw View Post
What is your load shooting like at present?? Is there any hope of accuracy??
Well, I set out with great intentions this morning... Got my table and targets and ammo and I get to the gravel pit and... No stool... I forgot my dang stool... So I shot just to check for pressure signs and then we packed it up and moved out to 500 yards for some feel good shooting off the hood of the truck. I shot some 150 grain Core Lokts with 46 grains of AA4064 in PMC brass. No development, just threw em together for the heck of it and zeroed my gun for them a while back. We were shooting across a big draw. 5mph winds where we were standing and I would figure about 10-15 out in the draw. After we figured out the wind we were hitting withing 6 inches of a clay pigeon in the gravel pit. They would have been viable kill shots, and we were just messing around. I wouldn't shoot that far at an animal with that wind... Not yet at least.

SO... Needless to say I will have to go back out next weekend and see if this ammo will group at all. And on a recommendation from another forum I am going to work up some 4064 loads to try out as well.
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