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Reloading Techniques For Reloading


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Die question.

 
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  #15  
Old 07-29-2012, 07:19 AM
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 301
Re: Die question.

A lot of good discussion on this thread. The OP claimed he is using Berger 115 grain bullets. These are the VLD design and are longer than standard hunting bullets in the same weight.

Make sure your seat die has enough clearance in the seat cup to grap the bullet on the ogive and does not bottom out on the tip of the bullet. If it bottoms out on the tip of the bullet it will not start straight into the case neck. I switched to the Forster seat die for this reason and runout went away. In my case I was loading the Ballistic Tip bullets not the Bergers but the same issue may be true with your die if you are having accuracy issues. It's already been stated a concentricity gage is a great tool to use to ferret out these kinds of issues and improve you loading techniques.

The Lee Collet Neck Die rules ...
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  #16  
Old 07-29-2012, 12:15 PM
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Re: Die question.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bart B View Post
How does a sloppy fit of the case neck to the chamber neck effect accuracy as long as the case neck's well centered?

Note that when a bottleneck case that headspaces on the shoulder is fired, the case neck doesn't touch any part of the chamber neck until after the bullet's left and a few inches down the barrel.
I shave necks on a few chamberings I shoot that have undersized necks (.246" & .263"). I size the necks loaded for about .001" to .0015" clearence all the way around (IOW, .002" / .003"). Brass dosn't expand as much in the neck as standard chambers do, and I don't seem to work the necks as hard. I have the idea in the back of my head that these cases are lasting longer, but have never did an accurate survey to prove this. I know I have one 10 case set of Hornaday .223 cases that have well over 35 firings on them and look just fine. Like I said; I can't prove it, but it seems that way.
gary
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  #17  
Old 07-29-2012, 07:56 PM
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Re: Die question.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trickymissfit View Post
Brass dosn't expand as much in the (tight) neck as standard chambers do, and I don't seem to work the necks as hard. I have the idea in the back of my head that these cases are lasting longer, but have never did an accurate survey to prove this. I know I have one 10 case set of Hornaday .223 cases that have well over 35 firings on them and look just fine. Like I said; I can't prove it, but it seems that way.
Some years ago, a friend and I took our .308 Win. match rifles whose chambers were both finished with the same reamer and had necks a tad above .344 inch; barely bigger than SAAMI minimum specs. We each used 44 grains of IMR4895 and Federal 210 primers. He used one Winchester case with a loaded round neck diameter of .337 inch and I used one Federal case with a loaded round neck diameter of .338 inch. We both reloaded our single case with Sierra 165 SBT bullets atop the powder charge. Both cases were full length sized with a standard RCBS die whose necks had been lapped out to .335 inch.

Each case was fired sized then reloaded until we ran out of test powder.

He got 57 loads on his case.

I got 46 on mine.
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  #18  
Old 07-29-2012, 10:32 PM
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Re: Die question.

Bart, you're preaching blasphemy here. Everyone knows that you work the brass less and get better accuracy with neck sized only cases!
I showed a few months ago that David Tubb full length sizes his match ammo and was roundly chastized by a well respected member here stating that Mr Tubb surely didn't care how long his brass lasted because he was sponsored and got his brass for free, so it didn't matter if he wore his cases out quickly by full length sizing them everytime.
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  #19  
Old 07-30-2012, 05:21 AM
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Re: Die question.

Quote:
Originally Posted by apexmtnman View Post
Bart, you're preaching blasphemy here. Everyone knows that you. . . . .get better accuracy with neck sized only cases!
Everyone?

Don't make any bets on that unless your billfold's thicker than all the others on this planet.

Having been on long range international rifle teams with David Tubb and other Nat'l champs, record setters, etc. and talking with them about reloading tools and techniques, I know what type of dies they, and I, use.

Check with Sierra Bullets and find out what type of resizing dies they use on fired cases that shoot their best match bullets no worse than 1/4 MOA at 200 yards.

But you're 100% right on neck sizing. Of course one works the brass less by neck sizing. That is unless a bottleneck case neck has more surface area than its shoulder and body does.

Would you believe that some folks get better accuracy with new cases than full length or neck sized fired ones? And they've used them in competition winning matches and setting records with them out scoring folks who've used both full length and neck only resized cases?
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  #20  
Old 07-30-2012, 07:49 AM
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Re: Die question.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bart B View Post

Would you believe that some folks get better accuracy with new cases than full length or neck sized fired ones? And they've used them in competition winning matches and setting records with them out scoring folks who've used both full length and neck only resized cases?
I've seen some stellar accuracy fireforming brass from 375h&h to 7mm stw also. Those cases shouldn't shoot worth a hoot if you have to go through all the case prep some go through, but I have been known to get 1/4 moa with them. I belive I was using h4831 and 120 grain Sierra's, which is even worse because it isn't a full case and you can't jamb the bullet into the rifling.
I've gotten lazy of late and haven't been re-forming to 7stw, but it was a bunch cheaper when I had the 375 brass and little stw brass. Selling the first 375 and needing to use the brass for it for something nudged the issue too.
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  #21  
Old 07-30-2012, 03:07 PM
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Re: Die question.

Bart
My post above was my feeble attempt at sarcasm. I don't own a neck size only die, I full length size all my cases just enough to get them to chamber easily as they are all hunting guns. I have seen many posters say that neck sizing fire formed cases is the best way to get accurate handloads and its nice to have someone as experienced as you verifiy that that is not really the case.
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