Hello, I am new here and am in the process of putting together a .223 for some varmint hunting.
I was really looking at the remingington VS but after seeing a few in person I was unimpressed (barrels not straight in stock etc.), now I see a lot of bad press on the web about them. Did I just get a couple of bad examples or are their problems that widespread (these rifles were at different stores).
the more I read the 12bvss savage sounds really good but for pure astetics would prefer a blued or matte barrel, and or a nice synthetic stock (not real critical but I love the was the 700 VS looks). the tighter twist on teh savage interests me for hte heavier bullets as I would like to use this on coyotes eventually (going praire dog hunting in may)
I guess I should put a question in here somewhere... I don't mind having a trigger job and touching up the bedding but am fairly new to centerfire and won't know what to do much beyond that if the VS doesn't shoot. I am looking for something that shoots good but is easily tinkered with/modified as I am using this as my first step into L/R shooting.
thanks for any advice you can give, I have already ordered the scope (burris signature 6-24) so I am set there. I got the matte finish to match the remington...
I'd go with the savage, I have a 12bvss in .308 and it shoots very well, around .5 moa, and with the new triggers they have on them adjusting is very easy, and you shouldn't have to bed these guns. At the local 500 yard shoot theres always alot more savages in the top 10 then remingtons
I may have gotten the exception, but my Rem 22-250 is all I could ask for. If I am doing my part it will go to 500 yards for prarrie dogs or wood chucks. When I first got it I tried several brands of ammo to see which it preferred. Several were in the 3/8-5/8" range. I haven't reloaded for it yet, so I don't know how good it could do with propperly developed loads.
That being said, if I were to look for another factory varmint rifle, it would be Savage. Too many horror storries about Remington and too many glowing reports about Savage to try my luck again.
Just my opinion.
"When working with the public, there are two things you need to remember. - 1. The public is a bunch of ignorant morons. - 2. YOU and I are one of them!"
Location: The rifle range, or archery range or behind the computer in Alaska
Re: Remington Quality, just how bad is it???
I have always seen poor quality in new remingtons. At one time I sold my VSSF which shot sub 3" groups at 600 yards to buy a Wby SVM. The quality was perfect, no tooling marks ect...
The funny thing is, it wouldnt group worth a crap and the POI would change slightly day to day. Maybee it was something I missed, but I kept it for quite a while hoping to fix the bugs. Never happened. I went back to the 700 and The first group was dang near a 1 holer. I have scince shot my best groups ever with this rifle.
I would stick to the 700 or a upper end savage.
Long range shooting is a process that ends with a result. Once you start to focus on the result (where the shot goes, how big the group is, what your buck will score, what your match score is, what place you are in...) then you loose the capacity to focus on the process.
Friends have bought several VS and VLS Rems recently and I have shot most on the range. Knock on wood but they were all excellent rifles. No doubt Rem has let some poor rifles out or they would not have so much bad PR on the web and elsewhere, but they also make fine rifles.
I would look at the Win. M-70 Stealth also, I have been involved with several this fall and they were all excellent. Also check the M-70 Coyote, it is a nice rifle in .223.
The Savages are good shooting rifles but their triggers and stocks are usually second rate relative to the Rems and Wins. The VS and Stealths come with H-S Precision stocks that are part of the reason they cost more.
The only thing that scares me on the Savage is the extractor system. That just seems a little suspect when I look at it but I'm not experienced to say.
I am looking at buying a couple Rems and a Savage so I may get a look first hand. All are new in a package deal.
I have owned Remingtons in the past (all new) and my most recent purchase was in 1999. I am thrilled with the gun and have never had a problem with it.
But for the prices, I'd own a few more. Just, after having custom barrels, I just can't bring myself to spend the money for a gun with a factory barrel again. The ones I'm looking at are a "deal" so I'm probably gonna strip them for the actions and throw the rest away.
My Brother recently bought a 700 at Wal-Mart. A 30-06 for a project. Everything on it seemed to work fine, though we never fired it.
To a certain extent, I think it's asking a bit much to buy a gun off the shelf and expect it to be a great gun out of the box as so many people do.
If you have something that you disassemble and reassemble enough times, sooner or later, you'll have two!
The 12 BVSS factor trigger was replaced by one from SSS. The new Accutrigger is getting good reviews. You may want to check the Savage (www.savagearms.com) and look at the new low profile stock, looks like the VLS stock.
The quality issue has me looking at .243 from Savage not Remington. Just don't have the funds and temperment to take a chance on Reminton. Hope this helps. Dan