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Looking for a scope

 
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  #8  
Old 12-17-2005, 05:48 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Central Florida
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Re: Looking for a scope

Thanks again Roy, yes it is 2nd FP After reading a lot here I began to see the difference. The scope deal is by no means
complete. I'd like to get started on the right foot so I'm open to suggestions with regard to scopes.

If what I understand is correct, shooting at the "same/calibrated" power setting will result in FFP performance when shooting a 2nd FP scope??? If this is correct, seems to render the higher magnification somewhat useless should the desired power (minumim error) be 10 power and the best power setting for the shot is much higher. I could be all wet here.
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  #9  
Old 12-17-2005, 06:08 PM
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Re: Looking for a scope

Thought I'd throw this in.

From Zeiss:

"Other interesting features, some of them exclusive, are: Reticle in the second image plane, so its size remains constant across the entire power range. At high magnifications little of the target is concealed -- an advantage when sighting small targets at great distances."
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  #10  
Old 12-17-2005, 06:18 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2004
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Re: Looking for a scope

Ol´Gator, I vote for FFP reticles instead of 2 FP. It is true that a 2 FP reticle will let you see the target.. but a FFP with a proper reticle will do that too.

I´ve seen and looked through one of those zeis and is great, but the FFP gives you the best and this one does not have it.

If you go for a FFP, check reticle subtension. Zeis makes other models as the 3-12 x 56 in FFP, but don´t know the reticle subtension in the mil-dot ( number 43).

Premier reticles can change a leupold into a FFP.... but my next scope is going to be a Schmidt bender PMII with a klein reticle ( mildot style, no dots but lines), reticle subtends very little.
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  #11  
Old 12-17-2005, 07:05 PM
ds ds is offline
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Join Date: Oct 2004
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Re: Looking for a scope

It may be useful to think about the
type of reticle and adjustments, plus amount of internal adjustment.

Looking at scopes in the 6-24 power range:

With 2FP scopes Hensoldt (military Zeiss), Zeiss, Nightforce and Swarovski are all at or near the top of the tree. Hernsoldt has 34mm tube a good amount of internal adjustemt and excellent glass but warranty is only for 2 years - it is intended to cover two years of hard military use.

The VMV Zeiss has excellent glass, the mildot reticle has a little 12x reminder at the top of it to remind you to set the scope at 12x for the mildot scale to be correct (24x would give you 1/2 mils and 6x 2mils).

Nightforce NXS 5.5-22x56 or 5.5-22x50, built like a tank, good optics, good value, lots of up adjustment, the illumination adjustment is crap on the NXS IMO. Swarovski (PVS 6-24x50)- I would check how much adjustment (up) it has I think not a lot but the TDS reticle might be a bonus but no lit reticle.

If you are going to "click" it is good to have a reticle and click values the same. Eg mildot reticle is easier to use with cm clicks (milrad) adjustments or if you want 1/4 MOA clicks go with a MOA type reticle - Nightforce have a good selection of reticles and both MOA and milrad adjustment options.

FFP scopes, in the quality you are talking S&B or USO. With USO I have only really used fixed power ones - have played with a couple of SN3`s so hard top comment other than big and heavy.

S&B I would forget the Precision Hunter 4-16x50 - not much adjustment and go for the PMII scopes - 34mm tubes. I really liked my 4-16x50 PMII and love my 5-25x56 PMII. The 5-25x56 is also big and heavy, on a hunting rifle I would have a look at the 4-16x50 PMII and 4-16x42 PMII (lit reticle). You can get them with 1/4 MOA adjustments or cm (milrad). The P3 and P4 reticles are mil based though. Speak to Pete Lincoln about S&B

Plenty has been written on the pros and cons.

One thought are you set on 6x-24x magnification range?

David.
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  #12  
Old 12-17-2005, 07:23 PM
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Re: Looking for a scope

Ol'Gator,

The reticle covering the target is is bunch of smoke, but most U.S. shooters seem to believe that.

With the reticle in the first focal plane the Mil Dot is 0.2 mils and stays 0.2 mils no matter the power. When you zoom to 14X everthing gets preportionately bigger. The Mil Dot still subtends 0.2 mil on the side of an elk or body of a rock chuck.

With the subject scope you first mentioned At 10 power (I think that would be the calibrated setting) the Mil Dot would cover 0.2 mils. 1 Mil @ 500 yds = 3.6*5 or 18" then 0.2*18 = 3.6". Half a Mil Dot would equal 1.8".

Even with eyes as bad a mine that's good enough to shoot coyotes and rock chucks on a pretty regular basis. Without having to develop a different drop chart for each power I "think" I may be using that day.

I use a Weaver Tactical 4.5-14 and flat love it. Though they quit making them.

Then another thought: I wonder what the actual power of the scope is when set on "what I think is 10X". I haven't seen a scope with "clicks" for power, just a sliding scale.

Get out your calculator and do some calcs on Mils and power settings. It drives me nuts. But some seem to like it.

Also google on Mil Dot and watch what pops up. you could read all night.
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  #13  
Old 12-18-2005, 07:06 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2005
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Posts: 135
Re: Looking for a scope

You guys don't know how much I appreciate this information. Obviously a new game for me and it has came at a good time. I don't have any problem with going to a different scope/power it was just a scope that became available.
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  #14  
Old 12-18-2005, 08:33 AM
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Re: Looking for a scope

Experience is the best teacher....as long as the experience is someone else's. Its a bunch less expensive too. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
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