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Going to shoot 500 yards tomorrow

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Unread 08-25-2003, 10:56 AM
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Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: mi
Posts: 991
Re: Going to shoot 500 yards tomorrow

What load are you using in your 338 lapua I just got back from shooting I was shooting 400 meters testing loads for my 338 imp
Crow Mag
If you think something is not possible move out of the way so the ones that are doing it can
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Unread 08-25-2003, 12:15 PM
Bronze Member
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Michigan
Posts: 66
Re: Going to shoot 500 yards tomorrow

Crow Mag I am shooting the 300 gr matchking lapua brass 87 gr Vit 560 fed 215 match primer. Dont know the speed, dont have a cronno. I'm guessing at about 2750. but it groups one ragged hole at 100 yds. I'm looking for some 338 AP to do some testing on cars and light trucks. You know of any one sell AP for the .338? Thanks

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Unread 08-25-2003, 01:01 PM
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Join Date: May 2001
Location: Sask. Canada
Posts: 2,410
Re: Going to shoot 500 yards tomorrow

Great images Dave, we did a similar drop thing but had a 12 foot tall backboard and put the aiming point at the very top, then moved in one hundred yard increments to get actual bullet drops. Shot from 100 to 700 and got some nice info. Sure nice to compare drop and accuracy as you change distances the way you did.
Looks a little hot and muggy. We don't have any vegetation where we shoot, lets us reach out a bunch more, but a lot of wind.
Nice shooting.
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Unread 08-25-2003, 03:24 PM
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Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Palmer, Alaska
Posts: 2,539
Re: Going to shoot 500 yards tomorrow

I like it Dave. I don't get more plain and simple than that, I'd call that consitancy, and eye opening for many too.

I've done the same thing with a handfull of friends, mostly two and three hundred yard, not too much practicing in there schedual type. Others have pulled up and BS'd with me about it while on the river bar shooting out to 800 and 1000 yards. The first comment from the stopper by types is, "how far away IS that?"

My friends actually get to see the whole session, start to finish, and leaves no doubt with them.

One friend of mine is pretty serious about learning the ins and outs of it, and is getting a grasp on the basics pretty well and getting into the deeper stuff a little bit more now.

He only started taking this LR stuff seriously after shooting with me "several times" and learning it wasn't luck, a good day at the range, no sighters needed, etc. He finally see's that if he puts the time and "money" into learning and practicing, he can do it to... he's naturally an excellent shot BTW, don't see that too often.

Getting guys past the point they've learned drops and how to compensate for them with their scope turrets using MOA is one of the big hurdles, or at least it I've found that to be true. MOA seems to confuse the hell out of most beginners and I think they just turn their brain off when they here it and think it's too complicated at that point to try and follow a conversation with even its mention. I admit, it took me a while to grasp how to correct for bullet drop at distances other than 100yds using MOA corrections.

When you first explain bullet drop and MOA correction to someone that's not heard the term, or to even someone that has but doesn't understand it, you can almost instantly see a look on their face that seems to indicate they think this is WAY COMPLICATED stuff here, and it simply ISN'T.

Showing someone as you have, then getting them figuring out their own drops, dialing in their own corrections and seeing the results on the target is the fastest way for them to SEE it's all too simple, even for them.

Some LR hunters will always leave us on very shaky ground, ethics wise. Ignoring the affects that changing winds will cause is one variable that any short range hunter takes lightly, when it comes to POI vs. POA.

Another is that the SR hunters group size at his normal killing range is far less an issue, a LR hunters is extremely important and "must" be known and used, along with other "varying" factors to base his maximum consistant killing range on.

Dave clearly demonstrates the possibility IS reality, on any given day within reason. [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

The arguement of LR being shooting, and not hunting will never go away, I leave it be, as it is simply subjective and most believe what they will on it.

The other arguements concerning shot placement and the percent chances of hits at LR are pretty cut and dry. Simple math usually decides who's full of BS in any situation when the facts are known, and anyone can see which stance holds up, or fails miserably.

I feel we have an obligation to our game and sport both, to stay well within our abilities, no matter how far we'd "like" to make a shot on game... we give em ammo against us all when we don't.

Dave, I hope you post this pic on every "can't do" thread concerning LR hunting you happen upon, aught to shut a few of them up or at least tone em down a bit. [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]
Brent Moffitt
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Unread 08-25-2003, 05:28 PM
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Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 2,369
Re: Going to shoot 500 yards tomorrow


I only wanted to shoot 500 yards in 100 yard increments. Hard to find a spot for a target up there so that it can bee seen every hundred yards...I put it at the slag pile and still had trouble at 300 yards (shot from the movers' 300 yard berm).

Take care shooting mild steel...that crater steel needs some place to go!

Have you tried Reloader25...might be worthwhile for you to give it a try...my data won't do you much good so start with the reloading manual suggestion(s).

I'd like to make it up to the mountain for Sniper II and/or Sniper III but work is going to be a problem (isn't it always!). I'll probably go up one or two days and play... I'd like to do the stalk(s), been a while since I've had my ghillie on (I'll bet there are some crusty old dried up briars in that suit somewhere...I hate those damn aged thorns). Rod has a helo now... no rotor and tailboom on the assembly (yet)... guess he'll use it for rapelling as soon as he gets it to the top of the tower (???), be a pretty short drop now...once you're horizontal your nose is in the grass.


That picture of me is from last year... I'm a LOT more handsome now [img]images/icons/wink.gif[/img]. It was pretty nice this last trip, only about 82 and lower humidity. The vegitation makes for a difficult time... at 500 yards I needed to wait for the wind to blow some branches out of the way so I could see the target...the round was about 20 inches above line-of-sight at the point where the branches were obstructing my view so no obstacle for the bullet...just couldn't see the target very often. Lots of mirage at the 400 and 500 yard event...shooting just at the top of the rise at 325 yards from the target...oh well, that's how it really happens so we deal with it.


My intent as you know was just to show (there'll always be folks that say it isn't this simple or I "created the data") how simple it is to shoot to a kill zone at distance to 500 yards. This is NOT Rocket Science... once we get past a few misconceptions and those tricky terms; MOA and NO HOLDOVER.

I have taught a few folks...generally one or two a year take on shooting and hunting with enhanced capabilities (don't dare say Long Range [img]images/icons/wink.gif[/img]). The biggest problem I have is getting folks AWAY from their buddies and the 100 yard 2" high mentality long enough to show them how it can be done...every shot.

(There's always the spouse problem too... folks just gotta have custom rifles sooner or later after taking this up and that's a fair bit of money!)

Getting a grasp on that MOA thing is a problem for a lot of folks...once they have it mastered it's a simple matter as you say. It's just hard to fathom the difficulty in switching to angular from linear measure.

Feel free to link to this thread is you think it will be of any value...
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Unread 08-25-2003, 09:43 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Montana
Posts: 259
Re: Going to shoot 500 yards tomorrow

Possibly the best way to show someone how simple it is to hit things at long range is to just get them out there and shoot.

My cusin was here who is 20 year old girl. She had never shot a rifle before. So what do I do? Set up some milk jugs and moved right back to 500 yards. Taught her the basics (safty, how the rifle works, ect.). Then I just said put the crosshairs in the middle and squeeze the trigger very gently. She not only hit the jug but the shot was only about 1" from the center (on her very first shot ever!), we shot a few more and she never missed one. So if someone who has never shot before can go out there and consistently hit jugs at 500yards the average shooter should have no trouble.
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Unread 08-26-2003, 09:36 AM
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Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Michigan
Posts: 66
Re: Going to shoot 500 yards tomorrow

Ya Doc 100 yard icrements are hard to do at the mountain. Its more set up for shooting at unknown distance. Not know distance.
At the range I was shooting the mild steel at is dug in the side of a hill. So the splash has good back stops on the sides for that.
Have not tryed the Reloader 25 yet.I got this load from Doc, Meats freind. From VA, and its what he and Meat shoot out of their 338s. It is working well in my rifle.
I'm going to be up their for sniper II and III. Work is sometimes a problem. But I work for the gov and my boss lets me have time off to go play. The sniper III class looks like its going to be a lot of fun. going to work those guys butts off. Looks like 16 guys that will be 8 two man teams. And sniper II is all full 30 guys that will be a lot of shooting and stalking. It will be a great time for all. And hopefully it will rain. I just love to train in the rain.
Crusty old dried up briars in your ghille thats what makes them work so well. Real camo.
New helo assaembly [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img] SWEET!! on top of the rapel tower. I see it now, fast ropeing with full pack and sniper weapon system. Or he might angel it so we could shoot the movers at 600yd. Looks like next summer will be a blast up at the mountian.
I see alot of that 2 inch high at a 100yds and I'm ready to go hunt too. Or the guy thats happy he can hit a paper plate 6 out 10 times at a 100yds. We have this range on the west side of the state with a 500 m range. I like to take Nate and Rae over their a week or two befor deer deason and shoot. We put up some head plates at 500 m and start shooting. Down down range when their is cease fire and paint targets. About that time you have have half the shooters over to see what you are shooting. And then start doing some simultaneous haed shots at 500 m. Like you do for glass shooting and it realy gets them talking.
If these guy would sent more time on the range they would shoot beter. You would think if a guy that was going to spend $4.000 to go out west to hunt. He would spend $500 and take a class to learn to shoot long range. Just my 2 cents worth.

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