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# which is easier to calculate: MOA or MILS?

#22
11-16-2012, 09:20 PM
 Gold Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Boise, ID Posts: 930
Re: which is easier to calculate: MOA or MILS?

What Broz said about different sized deer is absolutely correct. I've seen some deer the size of small elk. Because they are not a known size to start with, ranging them with your reticle is just a guess but I don't see any reason why a person shouldn't practice it a bit for when your range finder craps out, your horse steps on your pack or you hand it to a buddy and next thing you know, it's rolling down the mountain.

FFP can be helpful in tactical scenarios when sitting behind a scope and needing to maintain a field of view to pick up other potential targets and calling out numbers to your partner with as little interaction with your power ring as possible. Virtually little or none of which applies to hunting. I have a couple FFP's and they're not making enough of a difference to made much matter. A slightly lesser magnification appears to remove hand shake but since I mostly have a range finder, it doesn't really matter.

Bottom line... if the critter is close, just shoot it and if its not close, use your range finder.
#23
11-18-2012, 02:40 AM
 Platinum Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Pueblo, CO Posts: 1,228
Re: which is easier to calculate: MOA or MILS?

I'm the type that's into the math behind reticle-rangefinding and downrange zeroing. Nice part about investigating the math is it can allow you to improvise systems for longer-range shooting, and i want to know all that can be accomplished with the systems i have at my disposal.

Here's an example of understanding the systems of application--

This was a 100-yd. connection on this little piece of shale using this Ruger Mk. III/2x Barska on the second shot. I was headed back to my vehicle after prairie dog shooting with the little rig, and saw the light reflect off the rock on the side of a hill. It lasered at exactly 100 yds. so i thought to see if i could hit it. I checked the dope on this little rig and using a 50-yd. zero i needed 6 MOA of compensation to get to 100 yds. I wanted to see if i could accurately break up the plex-style reticle that's in this little Barska. I had previously measured the subtension between x-hair axis and plex post tip (PPT) and it was 15 MOA. Although i couldn't exactly figure the amount of compensation for the shot intuitively, i knew that 4 x 15/10 was 6. So i figured then that if i held 40% of the way down to the plex post tip it should be a hit or at least close. I knew that was correct since 50% (half way down) would be 7.5 MOA. I shot and missed but couldn't see the impact. I knew the math was correct though so i decided to trust it again, and held the same interpolative spot along the reticle and hit it on the 2nd shot. It split in 2 and rolled down the hill. When i went up to it it was laying there in 2 pieces. That was a very rewarding calcd. shot using the math that Scot detailed above but instead of being a MOA or mil reticle it was instead a plex-style reticle which can be applied the same way--obviously.

There are 2 mathematical concepts i believe it's important (or at least handy) to know and that is the following--

1) Downrange zeroing or rangefinding using either reticle or turret is defined by the mil-ranging formula, by simply replacing each variable in the equation with the values of your system.

2) Reticle subtension is ~inversely proportional to magnification.

By understanding these 2 concepts it should be easy to see that reticle-rangefinding itself can be applied with any 2 points at any distance relative to any other 2 points at a different distance. I often appy this concept using a mil-reticle at a magnification that's higher than mil-calibrated.

If you're into math at all, the practical application of these concepts can often be quite rewarding.
#24
11-18-2012, 04:47 AM
 Silver Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Rapid City, SD Posts: 174
Re: which is easier to calculate: MOA or MILS?

wow that's a great shot! i'd be proud of that too. This is very interesting. I wouldn't even think that a plex reticle would be designed for that. of course, a lot of that is beyond my scope of education right now. I feel like I need to become an experienced shooter with basic knowledge and skills before I can progress into the more complex issues-as with anything. But it's interesting to see how more accurate someone can be when using more in-depth factors and such. cool to know. thanks for sharing.
#25
11-18-2012, 04:06 PM
 Platinum Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Pueblo, CO Posts: 1,228
Re: which is easier to calculate: MOA or MILS?

Rock, here's a good place to start for angular math apps.--

Using these concepts we've actually calcd. the size of a target to within .3" of it's true dimension at 1000 yds., ranged antelope while moving, calcd. ranges to tgts. by "reverse milling" a reticle subtension on a known dimension tgt. at a known distance, then remilling a tgt. at an unknown distance, etc. It really is a lot of fun. Good luck with it.
#26
11-20-2012, 06:04 PM
 Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2012 Posts: 17
Re: which is easier to calculate: MOA or MILS?

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Broz Can you relate to there being 4 quarters in 1 dollar? or 4 .25's in 1 Can you remember this. 1 moa is 1" at 100 yds 1moa is 2" at 200 1moa is 3" at 300 1 moa is 4" at 400 1 moa is 5" at 500 and so on? So 1 moa at 350 yards is 3.5" or 3 1/2" and also at 375 yds it would be 3.75" or 3 3/4" This is all easy for me and why I choose MOA Jeff
I hope you do realize that 1 MOA @ 100 is actually 1.047197580733"
#27
11-20-2012, 06:20 PM
 Gold Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Hot Springs, South Dakota Posts: 530
Re: which is easier to calculate: MOA or MILS?

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Napolke I hope you do realize that 1 MOA @ 100 is actually 1.047197580733"
I can tell you he does. But if you can hold better than .047197580733 MOA than you are much better than most. The figure he gave is for "all intensive purposes".
#28
11-20-2012, 06:38 PM
 Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2012 Posts: 17
Re: which is easier to calculate: MOA or MILS?

Quote:
 Originally Posted by JackinSD I can tell you he does. But if you can hold better than .047197580733 MOA than you are much better than most. The figure he gave is for "all intensive purposes".
It's not about who can hold better.
To compensate for the bullet drop you could end-up with lets say 20 MOA, the error will be ~ 10 inches in this case.

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