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Distantfoe, message from Fiftydriver(Kirby Allen)

 
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Old 05-31-2005, 12:36 PM
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Distantfoe, message from Fiftydriver(Kirby Allen)

Distantfoe,

I have been unable to get an e-mail back to you so I will respond here and hope you get this message on the Allen Mags.

Len, please bare with me on this one please, I know it is not the correct place for this post, just want to get ahold of Distantfoe.


Distantfoe,

Thanks for the intrest in my Allen Magnums. They have truely outperformed my expectations and goals to give the big game hunters TRUE 600 yard shooting potential with minimal hold over.

Of the three initial Allen Mags, it is hard to pick one that is ballistically superior to the others, they are such a close match ballistically. The 257 Allen Mag and 270 Allen Mag have received the most testing by far as I am waiting for the 6.5mm bullets for complete testing of the 6.5mm Allen Mag. Anything the 257 AM will do, the 6.5mm will do the same with either a bit more velocity with same bullet weights or same velocity with slightly heavier bullets.

The 257 Allen Mag and the 6.5mm Allen Mag are such extreme rounds that I ran into some initial problems during testing. I wanted to use Retumbo and H50BMG for the powders of choice but quickly ran into a powder bridging situation in the case neck when firing the rounds. One shot would show normal pressure the next would loosen the primer pocket. Took a bit to figure this out and to be honest I was getting a bit worried that my Allen Mags would be dead in the water.

Then I tried some old H-870 I had left on the self and was very pleased with the performance of this powder with the 130 gr Bonded Core FBHP Wildcat Bullet. Pressures were very consistant, velocity was ver good, +3600 fps, and accuracy was running in the 1/3 moa range at 500 yards out of my Extreme Sporter test rifle.

Bad news was that H-870 is discontinued and not available so I went looking for a ball powder that would work and found AA8700 and WC872. Both of which work extremely well in the two smaller caliber Allen Mags with 8700 being a bit better for 100 to 130 gr bullets and 872 being better for the 130 to the huge 156 in the 257.

Another benefit with the ball powder is its lower burn temps compared to stick powders as well as being MUCH less abbrasive to the throat as the powder is pushed through the throat under extreme pressure. This results in longer barrel life.

Barrel life, with a 3 groove stainless barrel should be in the range of 1200 rounds with the 257 and 6.5mm Allen Mags if properly cared for. Now this is for top big game hunting accuracy not BR quality. I suspect they will hold 3/4 moa to this amount of shooting.

The only real downside to the 257 and 6.5mm is that the forming of 338 RUM cases to these rounds take several neck down steps and then the cases simply must be annealed to soften the necks after work hardening so this much. I do offer presized and annealed cases to my customers that only need to be fireformed and trimmed to length for ready to go brass.

The 270 Allen Mag is a different cat. The original 270 Allen Mag was also on the 338 RUM case but after testing it was proven that the 270 bore could easily handle the larger case capaity of the longer 7mm RUM parent case and case forming is simplistic to the extreme.

Simply run a 7mm RUM case through the 270 Allen Mag die to neck it down the proper 0.007" and your done, load, fireform and trim.

The 169.5 gr ULD RBBT does not offer the BC of the heavy bullets in the 257 and 6.5mm but it does offer higher velocity potential and still has a bc of .750 which is higher then the 240 gr 308 SMK bullet!!!

The 270 AM is also more user friendly as far as powder selection is concerned. With the lighter 130 and 140 gr bullets one can use powders such as Retumbo and Rl25 with great results. Still for extreme range shooting there is no better bullet then the 169.5 gr ULD which performs best with 8700 and 872.

Barrel life for the 270 Allen Mag should be in the 1300 to 1500 round range.

Powder charges will run as follows:

257 and 6.5mm Allen Magnums

100 gr...........103.0 to 107.0 gr 8700
115-120.........98.0 to 101.0 gr 8700
130 gr...........96.0 to 100.0 gr WC872
156 gr...........92.0 to 95.0 gr WC872

270 Allen Mag

130 gr...........88.0 to 95.0 gr Retumbo
169.5 gr........100.0 to 103.0 gr WC872

I offer specific load data to my customers with their rifles, the above are just general top loading areas and should not be considered safe until worked up to.

As of right now the only brass availible is Remington and I believe there is some Federal brass for the 300 RUM that can be used for the 270 Allen Mag and is reported to be better quality then the Remington hulls. I have not tested this brass though as the Rem brass has served me well in consistancy and accuracy when properly prepped.

I build all the rifles in the Allen Mags and have the only reamers offered so I am the only source for a rifle in an Allen Magnum round.

Redding is building the dies which I already have the first batch in stock but spoken for. Another order is already in the works.

Wildcat Bullets used in my Allen Mags are in stock with me so you can order direct from me without dealing with the international shipping issues to Canada. If a rifle is ordered I order in at least 500 bullets to have them in stock if the customer wants them shipped with the rifle.

For a long to extreme range sporter rifle or heavy rifle designed for big game hunting, there really is nothing out there that will run with the Allen Magnums using the Wildcat Bullets.

Good Shooting!!

I will keep trying to e-mail you with more informtion. IF you get this message let me know. I can get your e-mails fine, just can not respond.

Kirby Allen(50)
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Kirby Allen(50)

Allen Precision Shooting
Home of the Allen Magnum, Allen Xpress and Allen Tactical Wildcats and the Painkiller Muzzle brakes.

Farther, Faster and Flatter then ever before.

Web Page: www.apsrifles.com

allenmagnum@gmail.com
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  #2  
Old 06-01-2005, 10:02 AM
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Join Date: Feb 2004
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Re: Distantfoe, message from Fiftydriver(Kirby Allen)

Kirby,
What barrel lengths are you using to get your published
velocities? With or without break?
thank you
Joe
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  #3  
Old 06-01-2005, 02:01 PM
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Re: Distantfoe, message from Fiftydriver(Kirby Allen)

And while you are answering Joe B would you mind specifying the lenght of the neck of the formed case for the 257 and 6.5.

Thanks
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  #4  
Old 06-01-2005, 02:57 PM
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Re: Distantfoe, message from Fiftydriver(Kirby Allen)

Joe Boyd,

The listed specs are were chronographed from a 30" barrel. The Allen Mags will work well in anything 26 or over but really run hard in a 28 to 30" pipe.

Many thing these long barrels are cumbersome in the field, personally in the areas where these rifles will be used the longer barrel has far more benefits then disadvantages. Longer barrels just feel more solid to me on the bipod.

If weight is a concern I have a light weight Extreme Sporter with a full 30" heavy fluted #5 Lilja barrel that when used on a Rem 700 and a McMillan Sporter stock will bring rifle weight to 8.5 lbs compared to 10.5 lbs for my standard Extreme Sporters.

Muzzle brakes are up to my customers. I like them and on a 30" pipe they are not nearly as loud as one would expect. Just like seeing those big Wildcat Bullets land home.

Without a brake, recoil from the 257 and 6.5mm Allen Mags will be similiar to the 7mm STW with bullets in the 120 to 160 gr range.

The 270 Allen Mag will be nearly identical to the 7mm RUM in recoil with no brake.

Good SHooting!!

Kirby Allen(50)
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Kirby Allen(50)

Allen Precision Shooting
Home of the Allen Magnum, Allen Xpress and Allen Tactical Wildcats and the Painkiller Muzzle brakes.

Farther, Faster and Flatter then ever before.

Web Page: www.apsrifles.com

allenmagnum@gmail.com
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  #5  
Old 06-01-2005, 03:00 PM
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Re: Distantfoe, message from Fiftydriver(Kirby Allen)

Buffalobob,

The neck length on my 257 and 6.5mm Allen Mags are roughly .290". Depending on some brass and what is needed to square up the necks in trimming, they will range from .285 to .295" in length on average.

Good Shooting!!

Kirby Allen(50)
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Kirby Allen(50)

Allen Precision Shooting
Home of the Allen Magnum, Allen Xpress and Allen Tactical Wildcats and the Painkiller Muzzle brakes.

Farther, Faster and Flatter then ever before.

Web Page: www.apsrifles.com

allenmagnum@gmail.com
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  #6  
Old 06-02-2005, 01:20 PM
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Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 44
Re: Distantfoe, message from Fiftydriver(Kirby Allen)

Kirby,
I hope we don't get chastized for being on the wrong topic, but I have another question. Here in eastern Ok. we at times hunt out of towers. When we are in these towers gun weight is not an issue. For me, more weight is better. You mentioned a heavy rifle . In a 6.5 Allen Magnum, couild you give a description. Barrel length, which stock, and weight ect. if you were using a remmy long action?

Can you make a single shot out of a long action, the way you do a short action?

I realize this year is out of the question, but there is plenty of time for 2006.
thank you
Joe
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  #7  
Old 06-02-2005, 09:02 PM
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Re: Distantfoe, message from Fiftydriver(Kirby Allen)

Joe,

I will make a post on "Bullets, Barrels and Ballistics" in response to your questions just to keep things in the correct area.

Len has been pretty patient with me lately so I need to get these posts on the right boards.

Check out the post there in response to you in a couple minutes.

Kirby Allen(50)
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Kirby Allen(50)

Allen Precision Shooting
Home of the Allen Magnum, Allen Xpress and Allen Tactical Wildcats and the Painkiller Muzzle brakes.

Farther, Faster and Flatter then ever before.

Web Page: www.apsrifles.com

allenmagnum@gmail.com
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