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Bill & Lerch's "APS Xtreme Range 338 Allen Mag"

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Unread 04-07-2007, 07:35 PM
gbp gbp is offline
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Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: California
Posts: 227
Re: Bill & Lerch\'s \"APS Xtreme Range 338 Allen Mag\"

and here i thought i was the only one who owned a decker rifle vice. glad to see there are other dino's out there, beginning to think i was extinct.
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Unread 04-07-2007, 09:54 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: on the rifle range in Utah
Posts: 2,704
Re: Bill & Lerch\'s \"APS Xtreme Range 338 Allen Mag\"


You are right. There is no need for this to turn nasty. We both have included respect for one another in out posts and that is the way it ought to be. I told everyone here to trust what you had to say about fireforming that case several times. We both obviously have lots of experience on this subject and we agree to disagree to a point but we also agree on many corresponding things otherwise. We both have lots of trigger time only difference is you have to stop to run a lathe and I have to stop to run a press!

I think where you misunderstood me is here:
Wait a minute fella, It may be true that I only have 300 rounds down my 338 AM but I have several, SEVERAL thousand rounds down a few 257 AX, 6.5mm AX, 270 AX, 257 AMs, 6.5mm AMs, 270 AMs and 7mm AMs and all have had corn meal fireforming through their barrels and all are still shooting very well or shot to the point they have to be rebarreled but not before a good number of rounds were down their tubes.

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I was talking solely about .338's and the combined round count of them, not about all the guns you have fired. You have many guns that you feel require breakfast blasting and I have always gone the other way with my cartridge selections. I try to find the smallest case and the most efficient case to get the job done so regular fireforming works fine for me. That is all I meant by that.

Your uncle told me there were several times that the barrel got extremely heated. Could this be a contributing factor in short barrel life. ALso with your 338 Thunder, I know how much you have tested that round. I also know how hard it is to keep a barrel cool while doing load development or long range testing. There are many factors that can increase or shorten barrel life which are in the hands of the rifle shooter.

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Anytime your barrel is 1.5" in diameter, it is easy to not realize how hot the inside could be when the outside is luke warm. The moag got heated once in Idaho when going for a chuck at over 2300 yards, and once in a match when temps were in the 90's. But the barrel never got too much over body temp on the outside, but the inside was probably much hotter. Believe me, I have had my 17 hmr barrel much hotter than the moag or the thunder ever got! It is just the fact that (and I don't think you ever tried to deny this) that expansion ratios of high volume cases with heavy-for-caliber bullets are VERY hard on throats just by their nature no matter what you do to them. Such is the game of using calibers large enough to go to 2000 yards. But whataya going to do?

The high pressures the Moag shot well at surely had an affect on the throat, but that is where she shot the best unfortunately. Also a contributing factor was the fact that she liked RL25 the best which is a double based powder with high nitro-glycerin content which increases flame temps. But again, that's what she liked and there wasn't a lot we could do about it.

Anyhow, let's move on. I need to draw up some plans for the rail gun top of mine and send them to you so you can see if it can be incorporated into your half-block system. And we need some darn .375 bullets! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]
Find it
Range it
Click it
Pull it
Dump it

If it's not far, it's boring.
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Unread 04-07-2007, 11:03 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,651
Re: Bill & Lerch\'s \"APS Xtreme Range 338 Allen Mag\"

Sometimes, this site gets way to serious over opinions. Everyone has a different way of getting bullets down range. Some may disagree and others may agree, but we are all trying to accomplish one thing and that's trying to hit small targets at super long ranges.

Regarding the corn meal issue, maybe it works good for some and maybe not for others. I've been told buy many top gunsmiths to use corn meal for fire forming, so I am guessing Kirby knows what he is talking about. GG, your probably right too, using corn meal might have an effect on barrel life, but lets not fight over corn. The bottom line is that it works good for that person, so let it be.

I don't understand why there is so much arguing on this site. When I read these types of posts, it's really a DOWNER. I respect everyones opinion, of course unless it's way out of wack. The bottom line is we are all trying to do the same thing, shoot far.

The only things we should be arguing about is how to keep Democrates out of office, how to keep the illegal alliens out of our Great country, how to get better weapons for are fighting men and women, how to keep our country from being destroyed buy the ACLU and the Liberal media, and how to keep or country from being attacked buy Islamic extremists again.

Our county is in trouble, our troops our being treated like crap by the Democratic House and Senate, the speaker of the house is meeting with our enemies, and we have posts on here debating corn meal. Sorry, for being political, but I thought it might bring everyone back down to earth.

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Unread 04-08-2007, 09:27 AM
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Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Oregon
Posts: 953
Re: Bill & Lerch\'s \"APS Xtreme Range 338 Allen Mag\"

I agree with the political stuff, but disagree with the other statement.

I don't see it as an debate, I see it as people learning more about differing views and opinions. I don't think anyone is mad at anyone, just a good discussion. about....cornmeal?

well happy Easter, and thanks to everyone on this site for the posts, I've learned a ton.
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Unread 04-08-2007, 10:06 AM
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Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Alberta
Posts: 868
Re: Bill & Lerch\'s \"APS Xtreme Range 338 Allen Mag\"

I'd have to agree. I've learned a ton since I started coming to this site. Thanks to all.

And if you'd like to see in-fighting on a board, I can point you to one of the local hunting boards up here in Alberta. It can be like a soap opera at times!

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Unread 04-08-2007, 03:57 PM
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Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: USA
Posts: 2,598
Re: Bill & Lerch\'s \"APS Xtreme Range 338 Allen Mag\"

range it,check the wind, dial in correction, aim and only one shot
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Unread 04-08-2007, 04:26 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,651
Re: Bill & Lerch\'s \"APS Xtreme Range 338 Allen Mag\"

Don't get me wrong, I like the different opinions too. I just seems like sometimes people get really worked up about someone elses opinion. Anyhow, let's get off this subject so we don't hi-jack Bill & Lerches post. Sorry, guys, lets get back to talking about your Awesome rig.

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