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What a joke....

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Unread 09-27-2007, 10:03 AM
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: El Reno, OK
Posts: 1,922
My biggest beef wasn't necessarily w/the overpressure loads but w/the touting of the 125 gr bullet for lr use.

"Exbal confirms his wind drift and elevation comeups and in fact compared to the Rum 200 accubond at 3200 (now that is high pressure also) the WSM with the 125 Btip shows that the WSM is 73 inches flatter at 1000 but loses only 2 inches in wind at 10mph to the RUM."

Run those #s w/a 210 @ 3000 fps out of the same case and see what you get. I bet there is over 2 feet difference in wind drift and the 210 will have a higher retained velocity. The 210 is better suited for lr plain and simple. That is my main gripe.

Unread 09-27-2007, 03:57 PM
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: El Reno, OK
Posts: 1,922
"Of course the 210 will buck the wind better by 27 inches, but the 125 is still a lot flatter. Now what is more important, flatter or more drift? Plus he built a special purpose varmint rifle for the explosive effect on ground hogs, not a long range BR gun punching paper or hunting large game. Two completely different goals and different means to reach each goal. Just because it is not your goal or path, does not mean that it is wrong."

Ok, your championing this guy and that is fine. I've come to Kirby's defense on more than one occasion so I can appreciate you defending a friend or acquaintance. However, none of what you have said has addressed the issue of .162" @ 100 yds = 1.62" @ 1000 yds. To me, this is a blatant attempt to mislead people just to sell rifles. Maybe I'm alone on this and if I am, I appologize for seeing it that way. I just don't like to see people to be lead to believe something only to find out later that they spent alot of money and didn't get what they were lead to believe they were getting. I guess I'm just a bleeding heart .
Unread 09-27-2007, 05:08 PM
Platinum Member
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,651
Baily1474, I do not think Bounty hunter is defending a friend. I believe he is saying Richards set up with the proper componets, BAT or Nesika Action, 1-15 twist barrel and Norma 300 WSM brass, will produce 4000fps with a 125grN Ballistic tip. I think there are a bunch of people here who are hypocritical when it comes to talkng about high pressure ect. Also, I really think calling someone a liar, when it has been shown that what has been suggested by Richard is true, is wrong.

I have personally talked to Richard, and he is a great guy. I don't think he would suggest something that would intentionally hurt somone. Richard clearly states, in order to get these type of velocities with the 300 WSM, the shooter must use the proper components. Richard has been building custom rifles for many years, I am sure he knows what he is doing and talking about.


Last edited by wildcat; 09-27-2007 at 09:04 PM.
Unread 09-27-2007, 06:27 PM
Platinum Member
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Wilmington NC
Posts: 4,690

FYI Richard Franklin is neither a friend or an aquaintence. Never met the guy, however would like to.

He is a is a master at building his type of guns and pushing the envelope in that arena like many guys are here in there areas of expertise.

For that he deserves more respect than what some of the half baked comments made showed.

as for the 1.62", How many people took that literally? Yet how many times have we seen here, "my gun(s) shot/shoot a 3 shot group of x at X distance"!!!! Maybe so, was that the once and only time it did it? Yet it is revered as the "norm" and gospel here and only here can those type claims be made?

We have more damn .20 MOA or less guns on this board than all the winning guns of all the accuracy matches in history and none make it to matches. Maybe 2-4 have ever won any matches. Why is that if they are sooooo goood alll the time?

So now exactly which "outlandish" claims gets your dander up?:p

IMO it is still a bunch of horse puckey and hypocrisy.:mad:

Unread 09-27-2007, 10:07 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,651
Bountyhunter, I am glad you brought this topic back. When I posted this info about Richards new creation, I was told it could not be done, all the ballistic programs say it wont work, ect. I knew I was right, however, I did not want to get into an arguing match.

I am currently talking with Richard right now. He is going to build me one of his 300 WSM Varminters, chambered for the Norma brass and a .337 Tight neck, set up for the 110grn V-Max and 125grn ballistic tip bullets for 1000 yard varminting. Don't worry, I wont post the specs. To many guys on here like to poke fun, so I will spare you guys.

I E-mailed Richard today and asked him about the pressure factor and how many firings he is getting with the Norma brass. I should have an answer by tomorrow. I will let you know what he said.

Bountyhunter, I am glad you posted the information about the 300 WSM with the 125grn BT traveling at 4000fps -vs- the 300 RUM using the 200grn Accubound at 3200fps. This showed the 125grn BT shoots flatter than the 200grn Accubond, thats some awesome stuff. I know your going to have to correct for wind drift. The bottom line, the 300 WSM Varminter using the 125grn Ballistic tip shoots flatter than the 300 RUM out to 1000 yards, and with less powder and a lighter bullet.

My question to some on this site is, where are the compliments about Richard Franklins creation. I think what Richard has done is absolutley compelling in the shooting field, and he should be commended rather than ridiculed. I mean the man has been building rifles longer than some of us have been alive. For some to critizise this man is the real "What a Joke".

The man knows about building rifles, shooting and ballistics. I am sure knew what they were doing when they printed the artcle. They knew Richards new creation was a very complelling story for us varmint hunters who are looking for speed, accuracy and killing power out to 1000 yards.

I hope there is an apology to Richard. The "What a Joke" tittle is very disrespectful. It has been proven his set up is shooting the 125grn BT at 4000fps and very very accurate out to 1000 yards.


Last edited by wildcat; 09-27-2007 at 10:15 PM.
Unread 09-28-2007, 07:12 AM
Platinum Member
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: USA
Posts: 2,598
Originally Posted by wildcat View Post
It has been proven his set up is shooting the 125grn BT at 4000fps and very very accurate out to 1000 yards.


Can you post the proof?
range it,check the wind, dial in correction, aim and only one shot
Unread 09-28-2007, 08:37 AM
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: El Reno, OK
Posts: 1,497
Not to be disrespectful to anyone but get to throwing bullets out to 1000yds and you will see why this is such a joke. Bottom line is he is pushing a cartridge to unsafe pressures and hyping a bullet that is not as efficient at long range as others. Oh and the .162" at 100yds equals is 1.62" at 1000yds has got to be about the stupidest thing i have ever heard. IF that is true then i had a 22-250 that will group in 2" mark all day long at 1K with a 55gr BT!!!!!!!!

Sorry man but that dog dont hunt!!!!!!
Steve Elmenhorst
Third Generation Shooting Supply
"Products for shooters, by shooters"
monday-friday 8:30-5:30 CST
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