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History's Sniper show

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  #50  
Unread 12-25-2009, 08:58 PM
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Re: History's Sniper show

Think you missed the point completely-----sorry.
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  #51  
Unread 12-26-2009, 12:25 AM
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Re: History's Sniper show

Well I miss sthe point also, because I don't recall any denigrating. All I recall is an accusation of denigrating.

Maybe you're referring to the Canadian sniper? He did say luck played a role in his long range kill. He must have come from a different school of sniper training.
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  #52  
Unread 12-31-2009, 01:02 PM
ATH ATH is offline
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Re: History's Sniper show

It's a fallacy to think that saying there was some luck/chance involved in any way degrades the skill and dedication of our snipers. Let's say the rifle being shot was a .5 MOA rifle. This means that removing all input from the shooter, it's still going to throw roughly a 15-17 inch group at 2600m -- in other words, under the best of conditions, even ignoring wind (!!!) over a VERY long distance, some shots will hit and some will miss as this group is larger than the left-to-right target area on a man. So how is there not some luck/chance involved when one shot hits and another misses??

I think no one would deny the skill involved in getting very close on the first shot despite shooting new ammo, two-axis reticle hold-off, at altitude, at a walking target. I think it's pretty obvious that all of these things were also outside the parameters this sniper had practiced at, so his skills could not fully compensate for these multiple unknowns. THIS IS NO KNOCK ON THE SNIPER!!! This is not hunting, the only acceptable outcome is not a double lung shot. This is WAR, the goal is to prevent the bad guys from getting the good guys. A kill, a wounding, or sometimes getting close enough to keep their heads down, is good enough to call success. That is what this sniper was trying to do and he was successful at it.

I'm sure snipers take a ton of low-percentage shots that do not connect but help achieve an objective in one way or another. Again this is ok, it's not hunting ethics they are trying to live up to. They are not perfect, they are human.

Get over this fear of admitting there was some luck/chance involved because there was. Otherwise it wouldn't have taken 3 shots. Kudos to the sniper, for skillfully taking out a bad guy at an obscene range through a combination of amazing skill....and an element of luck. I find it just a bit absurd to assert there was no luck involved when he was shooting ammo totally different than what he had ever shot before. Somehow he magically knew how these rounds would perform well over a mile away??
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  #53  
Unread 01-01-2010, 12:10 PM
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Re: History's Sniper show

ATH----agreed. Some people spend too much time reading internet boards, magazines and TV Shows rather than shooting and understanding what it takes to successfully deploy a long range rifle period end of story....

Just got back last night from Colorado where my Smith and I completed my latest long range rifle a 300 Jarrett.
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  #54  
Unread 01-01-2010, 12:53 PM
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Re: History's Sniper show

Quote:
Some people spend too much time reading internet boards, magazines and TV Shows rather than shooting and understanding what it takes to successfully deploy a long range rifle period end of story....
So exactly where and when and with what unit were you deployed with a long range rifle.
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  #55  
Unread 01-01-2010, 01:41 PM
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Re: History's Sniper show

Quote:
Originally Posted by Buffalobob View Post
So exactly where and when and with what unit were you deployed with a long range rifle.
I just deploy to the ranch to shoot long range 100, 300, 600, and 1250(very large hill used for back stop for 1250 hence the more than 1k) with gongs set up at 600 and 1250. Been shooting long range for 30 years and competing 1k for a few now. The rifles and ammunition used by me are superior to what the military has ------ only for the reason that my "match" rifles and "match" ammunition would not last 1 MINUTE in the field. If you would like we can discuss in finite detail.
Example I have a BAT that when it is dusty and windy will require cleaning to keep the bolt from binding on the line plus a 1oz trigger is tough to keep going in perfect conditions.

I have had several AI AWM's over the last 15 years and they shot great (had 2 with one shooting the 250 SMK and the other shooting the 185 Barnes)so you could say that I am familiar with the equipment. Oh yes sold my Stoner SR25's last spring when people were paying Stupid money for them LOL.
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  #56  
Unread 01-01-2010, 03:52 PM
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Re: History's Sniper show

Q.E.D.

Quote:
Q.E.D. is an abbreviation of the Latin phrase quod erat demonstrandum, which literally means "which was to be demonstrated". The phrase is written in its abbreviated form at the end of a mathematical proof or philosophical argument to signify that the last statement deduced was the one to be demonstrated; the abbreviation thus signals the completion of the proof.
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