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Bubble level for rifle

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Unread 03-05-2004, 10:33 PM
dwm dwm is offline
Gold Member
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Texas
Posts: 721
Re: Bubble level for rifle

Ok, so I have a question about things being level. Sometime last year I started shooting at targets with diamonds on them. When I staple the targets to the frame I level them with a carpenters level.

When I shoot, I line up the scope reticle square to the diamond, intersecting at the corners.

Do you think this will work as an alternative to a scope level for shooting at the range?


These are my targets, feel free to use them if you like:

100 yard target:

200 yard target:

[ 03-05-2004: Message edited by: dwm ]
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Unread 03-05-2004, 11:06 PM
Platinum Member
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Palmer, Alaska
Posts: 2,539
Re: Bubble level for rifle

I have not commented on the pictures because neither way either of you posted them is "truely" representative of what I see in the real world, but I understand what each of you were trying to point out in posting them, each the way you did.

What you don't consider, IMHO, is I'm sitting in front of a square computer monitor viwing this, the picture is framed itself in a way that leads a person to one conclusion or the other, both which do not represent what I see in the field, and it's impossible for you to even post a pic on here that would.

The first pic that was round, still had a square border, that influences your thinking right there again.

Dave shows the "world" tilted because that's what the shooter tends to do and he's trying to explain, orient the hairs to the animal as we normally see it on flat ground, and that's all he was trying to show. Of course the world don't rotate in reality, but you only realize that looking through the scope AND seeing a frame of referance. Just look at a painted wall and rotate the scope, you may see rotating texture on the wall when you cant the scope, but damned if you can tell which way's up in that sight picture (the world).

Your surroundings are what help you determine which way is up, or they don't help, just depends on what the sight picture is that determines the amount it helps.

A friend of mine taught underwater emergency egress, disorientation will kill you there. Getting out of an airplane underwater begins with FEEL, bubbles on your face in the water, and much more.

Lack of trees for one, snow, or tundra covered ground, up in the rocks, and on and on can lead you off to cant your rifle thinking you aren't.

Too me, a couple degrees cant is something I won't be taking a chance on in the field at LR.

My GOD Doug, that's a giant picture! I'd say you'll be plenty fine, you used a level. [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]
Brent Moffitt
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Unread 03-06-2004, 08:13 AM
Platinum Member
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 2,369
Re: Bubble level for rifle


LOL & again LOL

That "Target Weenies" thing was just a little tinder for a fire.

You and I both know there's some "Target Weenie" in all of us.

BTW: Did that really hit a sore spot?? I'm sort of immune to the "Sniper Wannabe" thing!

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Unread 03-06-2004, 08:53 AM
Platinum Member
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Lock Haven P.A.
Posts: 1,071
Re: Bubble level for rifle

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR> Did that really hit a sore spot?? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>No Dave it did'nt...I have been called much worse [img]images/icons/wink.gif[/img] [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]
Boyd Heaton...
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Unread 03-06-2004, 09:29 AM
Platinum Member
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 2,369
Re: Bubble level for rifle


There appears to be a bug in RSI's cant
calulations. In both of these displayed
cases the sight height matches (closely as
not all decimal places are displayed) the
100 yard "drop" value.

I believe they've somehow linked the 100
yard drop value and the sight height to
the "start" value for the cant error
calculation, an error. Sight height
contributes to cant error, it does not
deminish the error.

Here's a screen that shows something is
obviously incorrect.

Cant is 90 degrees, as can be read from
the data on the image. This is for
trajectory data similar to a "standard"
308 Win trajectory. Notice that the
deflection values are in error, much too

This screen shot show data for a
trajectory similar to a 300 Win mag.
Notice the deflection error for a 90
degree cant is Zero -0- at 100 yards, an


"I've been called much worse"
Yeah, me too. [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]
And if it doesn't kill us it make us

For any budding "rocket scientist" types.

80.66 - 78.65 = 2.01.

2.01 &lt;&gt; 1.75

[ 03-06-2004: Message edited by: Dave King ]
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Unread 03-06-2004, 10:36 AM
Bronze Member
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Saginaw
Posts: 80
Re: Bubble level for rifle

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR>Yesterday, indicating a part with flats on it in an index head on the mill with the 3 jaw chuck at a crazy angle, I eyeballed the part (with no reference to anything square or plumb) and then put the "Starret exact angle finder" on it to find it off, "Minutes of angle".<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well dude, your trying to tell me that you couldn't see the mill table, dah, a level reference plane! Now I see the problem, not only is he a target weennie, he's a wannabe machinist.
On a good day us machinist are one step from rippin someones frekin head off, we make gunsmiths look like Buddhist monks. [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

[ 03-06-2004: Message edited by: AJ300MAG ]
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Unread 03-06-2004, 11:17 AM
CAM CAM is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Utah
Posts: 385
Re: Bubble level for rifle

I'd like to state, ask and confuse

Good info ifin you are a sniper and may NEED to cant and know your worst case. The level will only tell you you cant not how much.

Cant is a reality to some people (I guess)and knowing this they can adjust. basicly with the level you have consistancy this has to be good.

I personaly think it would be very unnatural to cant 6 deg ether left or right go with your gut feel not the target look. If you set up a crooked target you know it is crooked when you look thru the scope you dont have a need to line up the cross hair to the crooked target. IMHO

With all this said, YES I HAVE A LEVEL, but I been killing things for 25 years with out one also. you dont need a second morgage to own this simple tool.

I get very excited when shooting at game and never think to check the level! When that excitment is gone I'll quit hunting.

OK for the brain teaser

Nightforce RP2 sighted in at 600 using hold/under and hold/over.

6 deg cant at 500 POOOOH &lt;MOELK

what happens at 100 and 1K sure there is adjustment but how much kind of changes things I think.

I respect where both of you are coming from and have enjoyed this tread. just because the world is round and turns, you dont have to turn your scope to adjust for it use your gut feel for level and then check the level for peice of mind and shoot.

Dave could you run those numbers for 180 deg because I installed my bipod on wrong. LOL

Keep the info flowing you are never to old to learn.

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