id have the headspace checked on the winchester and buy it. i cant imagine it looking that good outside and not be good inside.
that said, savage is also a tradition in this country.
and they sure are giving both remington and winchester a lesson in what shooters want.
tradition be damned, those old model 70s couldnt hold up to the new savages as for perfofmance.
how many shooters are using the actions?
tradition is why the britts lost our war for independence.
and its why winchester is in the toilet compared to savage.
Yobuck, I did not know Savage ever contributed in that way. I apologise for my lack of knowledge on that matter. As for the Savage/Mossberg action....Well, yes its strong. rough as a cobb but strong. To me its like buying a Chevy for your mode of transportation,( I love Chevy's) and then having to admit its actually a Chevy Geo because it was the cheapest reliable form of transportation to get untill you can afford something better. Ya it works. Times are tight, and Savage has a large following. Most of wich from what Ive seen buy the gun, throw away everything but the action and build a cheap as possible ''custom rig''. As for tradition, where was Savage when the top pics for custom builds were THE OLD(as you stated) Win model-70, Rem 700, and 98 Mauser. Now that you can ''can'' the bbl and ''switch'' on a whim on a cheap, but strong action, folks like em. Im not a ''walmart'' kinda guy. I get the best I can afford, and Savage is just not my opinion of the best I can afford. They have come up in the world, but to me they'll still always be a Savage.
The Britts lost the war of our Independance because of being streached way too thin to cover thier investments, and having to fight on too many fronts in too many parts of the world. And in part thanks to the French who only helped us because they werent ''big fans'' of the Britts. Combine that with the grace of God, and great men with unimaginable intestinal fortitude, fighting for thier freedom, and willing to adapt tactics taught to us by the Indians and America was born. If youd like you can find cuontless referances of militia and minute men picking up brown bess muskets. German Jegers with rifled bbls were way more accurate, and used for picking off the ''leaders'', but were so uncommon durring that war they had very little influence compared to hit and run Indian tactics, and keeping the enemy off balance. When confronted by an overwhelming force, offensive gurrila warfare has ''traditionaly'' been the best defense all over the world. The Brits had no counter for that kind of fight. So your ''tradition be damned'' has some merrit, however Overwhelming force with a well regulated army would've prevailed eventually, had they stuck to it. But as stated before they were spread too thin. I for one am very glad our forefathers had the gutts to do what they did, (and had ''traditionaly'' been done by people for centuries in every corner of the globe) and that the Britts pulled out of the fight.
That scares the hell out of me especially in todays world, and America being held to a higher standard than the rest of the world. Thank God for our special forces doing what needs to be done covertly.
Opinions vary. If you like Savage more power to ya. I like Winchester. So we dissagree...........oh well. As long as your happy with yours for your reasons, and Im happy with mine for my reasons, and in the end we are both in search of bettering ourselves as shooters, then we have that in common.
Opinions are the hardest things to change in a person. Im not trying to change yours. You called me on Savage helping defend our freedoms. I apologised and will take your word for thier service to our country. But I think your comparison of Savage compared to Winchester has too many holes to hold water.
My vote has been cast for aiding you in your choice Scottsgun. Im sorry for temporararily interupting your thread. Good luck in your choice, and I hope you have great results and success with your pick of either rifle.
"Its not Rocket Surgery.....'
GOD,GUNS,&GUTTS MADE AMERICA, LETS KEEP ALL 3!winmag
"I have No idea why that cop made me ride in the back seat, when I Clearly called Shotgun!"
Savage with no holds barred, there are four in my collection; You will find it necessary to replace the cheap factory stock (unless it's the accu-stock). The accu-trigger on the other hand is, in my opinion, the very best factory trigger on the market right now (sorry winmag). The barrels made by Savage have proven to be of the most accurate factory barrels made. Couple a strong action with the best factory trigger (IMHO), with their notoriously accurate factory barrel & a quality stock..... I believe you will be VERY pleased with the outcome.
I shoot competitively and am Very focused on accuracy and then Aesthetics. If you read my posts this is already known and one reason my rifles are built from the ground up so I get both.
IF I WAS forced to pick a factory rifle where all I did was buy or load ammo and go shoot----no question the Savage would be my choice. Do I think it is the most accurate rifle being built by a commercial company right now yes. IMHO it is also the least attractive sans the Browning but as a Great Man Once Said “THE ONLY INTERESTING RIFLE IS AN ACCURATE RIFLE”!!!!!!!
The Truth Is Not Always Good For Business!!
A couple facts come to mind when I analyze your question, please take them for what they area worth.
1.) An interview with Bo Clerke posted in Shooting Times (i think) a couple years back, Bo has been involved in Mil Spec barrel advancements & construction, Numerous analytical investigations & Quoted by the magazine as being on the forefront of barrel technology & development (not my words). When asked who makes the most accurate factory barrels his answer was Savage makes the most accurate factory barrels hands down.
2.) I have a Savage model 10 BVSS in 22-250, after I decided to add more zip to the old girl I had the barrel removed and rechambered in 22-243. My gunsmith who has worked with barrels from every major manufacturer you can think of called me in to pick up the completed rifle. When I arrive, he tells me he cannot believe what he found when rechambering. He stated that particular barrel was the most concentric barrel he had ever seen, it showed more concentricity than all the Krieger, Hart, Lilja, Douglas etc barrels he has ever installed. Of course making the long story short the rifle shoots ~1/4MOA, I wish I could give you the concentricity details but I'm no gunsmith & this happened a couple years ago (i've slept since then!). Obviously all run out was measured with a dial caliper... he still talks about that barrel.
These are the facts I have, take them for what they are worth, just another .02 in the age old arguement. Thanks for asking, I'm going to research the Bo Clerke article & if I find it I will post a hyperlink to it for everyone to enjoy.
I would take that model 70 winchester and freefloat the barrel and bed the action. Leave that stock on it. That particular rifle is a very nice rifle and I think you would be satisfied with it. The savage would also do anything you want. I would get the new savage with the accutrigger and accustock if you go that route. They are very good shooters and you don't have to do anything to them unless you just want to spend some money.
Predictions are difficult, especially when they involve the future