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New Allen Magnum and APS rifle design finally ready to test....

 
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  #8  
Old 02-01-2006, 07:55 AM
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Re: New Allen Magnum and APS rifle design finally ready to test....

Not trying to sound stupid, but what does the v block do. Does it act as a huge recoil lug or what? thanks
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  #9  
Old 02-01-2006, 08:42 AM
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Re: New Allen Magnum and APS rifle design finally ready to test....

SS7mm,

We will see when the bullets hit the paper but things should work very well I suspect!

As to the 270 AM, I am currently not chambering the 277 or 7mm in the Savage rifles until I can chamber one and prove that it will handle the increased case diameter of the Lapua case.

I am sure it would as this rifle was chambered in the Lazzeroni Patriot and Tomahawk SA magnums which have the same head diameter but just want to prove it to myself first.

The contour on this barrel is roughly a #7 ahead of the 8" full diameter barrel shank. I am about to order another contour design from Dan which is basically the same thing but with a #5 contour to drop another pound off the barrel weight. This will happen after I test this design and prove it meets my goals for this design.

This V-Block design will handle up to a 1.250" straight cylinder barrel of at least 32" in length with this stock.

For a larger diameter 1.350" barrel up to 36" in length I recommend my 10" V-block system which is to large for this stock design.

Keep in mind that the A-5 would have to have some serious ballast in the butt stock to balance the rifle. This specific rifle balances about 1.5" ahead of the receiver face which in my opinion is pretty good considering the light weight of the stock and all the metal ahead of this point of the rifle.

Will let you know how she shoots.

Kirby Allen(50)
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Home of the Allen Magnum, Allen Xpress and Allen Tactical Wildcats and the Painkiller Muzzle brakes.

Farther, Faster and Flatter then ever before.

Web Page: www.apsrifles.com

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  #10  
Old 02-01-2006, 08:47 AM
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Re: New Allen Magnum and APS rifle design finally ready to test....

Bill,

The 277 was not developed in any way to make the 270 AM obsolete. It is much more involved to load the 277 AM because of the parent case.

For ease of loading and high performance, the 270 AM is still the best of the lot in my opinion. The 277 will outperform the 270 espeically with the 185 gr class bullets but they are both so far superior to the other 270s around that its not worth even comparing.

In fact you have to get into the huge 30 and 338 magnums to get the ballistic performance of either of these two rounds so you are not giving much up in performance.

Kirby Allen(50)
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Kirby Allen(50)

Allen Precision Shooting
Home of the Allen Magnum, Allen Xpress and Allen Tactical Wildcats and the Painkiller Muzzle brakes.

Farther, Faster and Flatter then ever before.

Web Page: www.apsrifles.com

allenmagnum@gmail.com
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  #11  
Old 02-01-2006, 08:59 AM
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Re: New Allen Magnum and APS rifle design finally ready to test....

Looks damn nice Kirby,

I think I have seen that barrel contour before [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img], looks like a good rifle for a good guy

Like SS7mm said hopefully this means the big 185gr ULD is on its way, we are dang near dry on bullets down in OK.

Looks guide, i am ready to see how she drives


take it easy
steve
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  #12  
Old 02-01-2006, 09:00 AM
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Re: New Allen Magnum and APS rifle design finally ready to test....

EZ Shooter,

Actually floating the receiver eliminates any issues with the receiver flexing under the weight of the barrel or during recoil.

The Rem 700 receivers are pretty stiff until you hang a heavy 30" barrel off it in a conventional bedding system. In the Barrel bedding V-Block system, all the receiver needs to do is support its own weight and that of the scope, basically nothing compared to what is asked of the receiver during conventional bedding.

The recoil energy is transferred to the stock in the same traditional manor as a conventionally bedded rifle using a recoil lug that contacts the stock. All the Barrel bedding V-Block does is provide an extremely consistant and stiff, support for the barrel.

Basically the barrel supports its own weight as well as the receiver and scope which it is more then strong enough to do.

The V-Block does not absorb any recoil energy in my design unlike the clamp on block designs. As such there has to be a recoil lug to transfer recoil energy to the stock. This may be a disadvantage to those using the clamp on block designs but there are also several advantages as well.

Mainly,

1. size of the stock can be dramatically slimmer
2. Rifle weight can be kept lower
3. Scope mounting height is conventional
4. Rifle retains traditional appearance

The basic idea behind my design and all the V-Block and barrel bedding block designs is this. This is an extreme example to show you the idea clearly.

Say you have a 1.250" straight cylinder barrel that is 35" long. If you fit this barrel and bed it conventionally to most receivers and full float the barrel you will have a VERY long unsupported barrel which may cause some accuracy issues with receiver flexing.

Now if you take this same barrel and use a 10" V-Block, now you still have the 35" 1.250" diameter barrel but only 25" of it are floated. The first 10" of the barrel are solidly held by the V-block.

Now anyone can easily see the advantages of this. Instead of having 35" of heavy unsupported barrel, now you have only 25" of heavy unsupported barrel.

Barrel stiffness is key to fine accuracy. Stable bedding is key to consistancy. Now a 25", 1.250" diameter barrel is EXTREMELY stiff and a 10" long heat treated aluminum V-Block is about as stable as it gets for bedding.

Basically you get all the advantages ballistically of a 35" barrel but with the rigidness and stability of a realatively short 25", 1.250" diameter barrel.

Floating the receiver really does not offer any significant accuracy advantages, what it does do though is eliminate the possibility for some very serious accuracy degrading issues.

Good Shooting!!

Kirby Allen(50)
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Kirby Allen(50)

Allen Precision Shooting
Home of the Allen Magnum, Allen Xpress and Allen Tactical Wildcats and the Painkiller Muzzle brakes.

Farther, Faster and Flatter then ever before.

Web Page: www.apsrifles.com

allenmagnum@gmail.com
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  #13  
Old 02-01-2006, 09:01 AM
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Re: New Allen Magnum and APS rifle design finally ready to test....

Mike,

Yours is in the next batch my friend. I promise you!!

Kirby Allen(50)
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Kirby Allen(50)

Allen Precision Shooting
Home of the Allen Magnum, Allen Xpress and Allen Tactical Wildcats and the Painkiller Muzzle brakes.

Farther, Faster and Flatter then ever before.

Web Page: www.apsrifles.com

allenmagnum@gmail.com
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  #14  
Old 02-01-2006, 09:18 AM
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Re: New Allen Magnum and APS rifle design finally ready to test....

Roy,

Yes this system will offer 2K potential I am quite confident. I have tested my heavy sporter in 270 AM out to 2200 yards and in good conditions it was consitantly grouping in the 1 moa range at this distance. Still, thats just shy of 2 foot groups but at that range I was happy.

This rifle will do better.

The V-Block is bedded permanently into the stock. If you look at the pics of the V-Block you will see the releif groove milled into the bottom and sides of the block. These are basically to increase the bond strength to the stock when bedded and all these grooves are filled with bedding compound. There are similiar but smaller cuts in the inside of the stock as well.

There has to be a recoil lug used with my design. The reason there is no lug used with the large clamp on block designs is because the block hsa enough clamping strength to securely hold the barrel under recoil and then the block itself is used for the purpose of a recoil lug.

My design is totally differnet.

While the barrel is solidly held down into the V-block via two 1/4-28 bolt that are threaded directly into the barrel, this is not a strong enough hold to eliminate the need for a recoil lug.

In fact, the two mounting bolts are totally floated in the V-Block and seat on 82 degree counter sinks. The only thing that contacts is the tapered head of the bolt against the bottom of the V-Block and the threads in the barrel.

As such, if there was no recoil lug, the recoil energy would easily be enough to shift the barreled receiver back in the V-Block until the bolts were binding agains the block. At which point, shearing of the bolts would probably be soon to come.

Using a conventional Recoil lug prevents this issue so using them together offers the advantages of the clamp on block design but in a package that is conventional in appearance and allows much slimmer rifles and conventional scope mounting heights.

Some will say threading the bolts directly in the barrel is a bad idea. I have yet to see any accuracy issues doing this if done properly.

Mr. Holland has been building rifles using a similiar design for many years with no problems. My design is similiar but totally unique in comparision to his design. Same ideas used for the design though.

If we get the ballistic numbers we are prediction, at 2000 yards, and the 185 gr ULD RBBT will still be climping along at nearly 1600 fps and packing just over 1000 ft/lbs of energy. Thats plenty for deer size game give a quality shot placement to the vitals.

Now I am not saying this is a 2000 yard deer rifle, just showing the numbers that we are hoping to get out of this rifle.

More realistic is 1000 yard deer hunting. At this point we will be looking at 2330 fps and +2200 ft/lbs of energy. Not to bad for a 270!!!

We will see what actually happens when the bullets get in the air though!!

Kirby Allen(50)
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Kirby Allen(50)

Allen Precision Shooting
Home of the Allen Magnum, Allen Xpress and Allen Tactical Wildcats and the Painkiller Muzzle brakes.

Farther, Faster and Flatter then ever before.

Web Page: www.apsrifles.com

allenmagnum@gmail.com
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