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Long Range thick skin bullets

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  #85  
Unread 09-22-2013, 10:20 PM
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re: Long Range thick skin bullets

Quote:
Originally Posted by stenger View Post
Not sure that was the pic that was sent to me.

Very good point I love Bergers but I now agree I won't be shooting a berger at everything.
Stenger.....not trying to tear you apart! I believe this post was VERY worthwhile and causes people to think about things with a more open mind. Your point about the thinner jacket that is meant for hunting being possibly worse, is well taken. My opinion is, it wasn't meant for hunting moose; or at least for taking that kind of shot angle. Every bullet has a window in which it works properly. I am guily of pushing the limit to the other extreme, and in my opinion, lost an animal due to lack of expansion. We all have things to learn....Rich
p.s. Had he shot the moose at 600 yards, the bullet may have done it's job even at that angle?
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  •   #86  
    Unread 09-22-2013, 10:38 PM
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    re: Long Range thick skin bullets

    None taken just education.
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      #87  
    Unread 09-22-2013, 10:52 PM
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    re: Long Range thick skin bullets

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by stenger View Post
    None taken just education.
    Keep up the good work! I appreciate people who are honest and not afraid to be "politically incorrect".......Rich
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      #88  
    Unread 09-23-2013, 03:45 AM
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    re: Long Range thick skin bullets

    I have seen a Hornady SST fired from a .308 do the same thing at short range on deer. The difference is that the bullet didn't have to travel far to reach the vitals, thus the fact that the bullet came unglued resulted in an instant kill.

    I have a hard time viewing this episode as a bullet failure. The Berger bullets behaved the way thin jacketed cup and core bullets behave. I see this as a classic example of failure to understand the limitations of the projectile being used, and ultimately, failure to match the tool to the application.

    I have yet to shoot Berger VLD or Hornady AMAX type bullets at anything but paper. However, based on what I have seen standard cup and core hunting bullets do at close range and high impact velocity, I am not willing to use thinner jacketed bullets, even on deer, at normal hunting ranges from most rifles. I practice with these kinds of bullets, though, because I am working on extending my effective range and want to be prepared for the day when I finally have the chance to use them at long range.

    Having said that, I agree that the information supplied by the OP is useful to all of us in helping to define the limitations of our tools. Thank you, stenger, for the education and lessons learned!
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      #89  
    Unread 09-23-2013, 03:57 AM
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    re: Long Range thick skin bullets

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by elkaholic View Post
    Every bullet has a window in which it works properly. I am guily of pushing the limit to the other extreme, and in my opinion, lost an animal due to lack of expansion. We all have things to learn....Rich
    p.s. Had he shot the moose at 600 yards, the bullet may have done it's job even at that angle?
    I have seen the lower velocity limit for expansion of Berger Hunting VLD's defined as being between 1700 and 1900 fps (a bit lower with AMAX's). However, I have yet to see anyone define the upper limit for impact velocity while still obtaining optimum penetration.

    I would guess that the upper limit with thin jacketed bullets like these would be around 2600 or so, but that is just a WAG.
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      #90  
    Unread 09-23-2013, 07:50 AM
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    re: Long Range thick skin bullets

    Well, I guess I'll be doing a 25 yd water jug test with my 308 230 Hybrids out of the RUM.
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      #91  
    Unread 09-23-2013, 08:08 AM
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    re: Long Range thick skin bullets

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MontanaRifleman View Post
    Well, I guess I'll be doing a 25 yd water jug test with my 308 230 Hybrids out of the RUM.
    I would think that you need to see 4-6 jugs to feel confident.

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