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Consistent 3 inch 1000 yard groups

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Unread 12-22-2007, 11:40 PM
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Columbia, MO
Posts: 1,476
Consistent 3 inch 1000 yard groups

From Ammoguide.com-"Many .50 BMG rifles are capable of consistently producing groups under 3 inches at 1000 yards."

Is this true, and if so, how come more people don't use the 50 for hunting, and how would the 50 be so much more magically accurate than Mr. Allen's 338 AM shooting bullets with the same BC at the same or higher velocity? I have never heard accuracy claims like this before, but ammoguide always seem to have accurate information on their site.
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Unread 12-23-2007, 01:05 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Blackfoot, Idaho
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Two reasons I would suppose:

1) I smell something funny there....

2) 15 pound weight limit with everything attached in Idaho. The 50 is the reason for the regulation.
I may be the slowest guy on the mountain . . . . but . . . . I'm on the mountain!
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Unread 12-23-2007, 10:15 AM
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"Many .50 BMG rifles are capable of consistently producing groups under 3 inches at 1000 yards."

there isn't any gun out there that can do this much less a 50!

the Polish have a word for this...it's BULLSHITSKI
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Unread 12-23-2007, 10:27 AM
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Columbia, MO
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Why a weight limit? I did see a 9.9 lb BMG online..."law enforcement only".
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Unread 12-23-2007, 11:32 AM
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Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Central Washington
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Idaho has a weight limit to keep people from using the .50 for hunting.

I have seen a single shot .50 light enough to meet the limit, even with a scope and bipod, but I like my shoulder where it is, and didn't even consider it!

3 inch groups at 1000 yards are NOT a function of the rifle. If they happen, they are a function of the shooter who understands his rifle!

That said, I think 3" is actually smaller than the world record group at 1000 yards!

However, some of it depends on what you use as the group! 3 shots, 5 shots, 10 shots?

If I remember correctly, the smallest 10 shot group is right around 4 inches, with a 5 shot group under 2 inches, (Tom Sarver if I remember right) and a 3 shot group smaller than that. None of those were .50's.


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Last edited by bwaites; 12-23-2007 at 11:45 AM.
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Unread 12-23-2007, 07:36 PM
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IBS light gun (17 lbs and under) record was set this yr with 5 shots into 1.4 inches at 1000 with perfect 50 score and 5x with a 300 Hulk (shortened 338 Lapua with 240s) by Tom Sarver in Ohio, previous record of 1.5 had stood for about 10 yrs with 6.5-286 super by Rich DeSimone of NC.

IBS HG record is now at 3.4 inches for 10 shots at 1k.

3 inches for a 50 tactical is one shot only group!!

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Unread 12-24-2007, 03:29 PM
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I have shot the big 50 ALOT. Tested more loads then I care to talk about, shot several different rifles from field grade to the high end BR rifles.

What I have learned is that the 50 BMG can be an amazingly accurate and consistant chambering. I have also learned that it often takes dramatically more bench work to get the 50 to shoot well.

My personal best 1000 yard 5 shot group is just under 5" at 4.988" ctc. I have shot several three shot groups that were in the 4 to 6" range. That said, for each of those groups, you can bet there have been easily a hundred that were in the 1/2 to 1 moa range at that distance, even with the best rifles out there.

A 50BMG rifle capable if 3" groups at 1000 yards, sure, its possible, doing it all the time, BS!!!

The limiting factor is generally not the rifle with the BMG, its the shooter and the handloader. There is no surplus ammo that will get better then 1 moa consistantly at 1000 yards. Most will be in the 2 to 3 moa range, only the very best match grade surplus ammo will better this and again, not by much.

Good handloads, thats another story all together. I prefer the Hornady A-Max, just more user friendly being a lead core bullet in different bores.

Problem is, no 50 BMG, save the tripod mounted M2 is easy to shoot. Now some of the heavy +50 lb rifles are not hard to shoot but they still produce alot of muzzle blast which is often more distacting then recoil. In a rifle 30 lbs or less, recoil IS AN ISSUE, no way around it. The recoil is not severe in most cases but its like nothing produced by a conventional chambering. You literally get moved by its recoil, about 6-8 inches rearward.

SO have watches some of the very best long range shooters in the world shoot the 50 BMG in what seemed to be ideal conditions, they are still very happy to get sub 6" groups which is called a "Screamer Group" in theg FCSA BR matches.

If you could hold 1/2 moa aggregate on your groups, you would win most 50 BMG BR matches. If you had a rifle that would shoot 3" groups at 1000 yards consistantly, you would never loose, EVER.

That says it all, simply have to look at the match results to see what the very best 50 BMG shooters in the world are doing with the finest precision 50 BMG rifles made, this claim you found is simply a sales pitch or flat out BS.

As far as comparing the 338 AM to the 50 BMG, at least comparing the 265 gr AT RBBT at 3500 fps to the 50 BMG with a 750 gr A-Max at 2700 fps, there really is no comparision, ballistically, in every catagory except retained kenetic energy, the 338 AM smokes the big 50 BMG.

Not only that, recoil is not an issue of any kind with the 338 AM, even in 16 lb class rigs. Still a good amount of muzzle blast but nothing like the BMG. The flatter shooting and less wind drift makes it easier to make small groups or hit small targets at long range with the 338 AM then the BMG.

Only advantage really is barrel life, the BMG has a very good barrel life compared to the 338 AM. That is why the 375 AM will be here very soon, just to boost barrel life while keeping ballistic performance similiar.

Good SHooting,

Kirby Allen(50)
Kirby Allen(50)

Allen Precision Shooting
Home of the Allen Magnum, Allen Xpress and Allen Tactical Wildcats and the Painkiller Muzzle brakes.

Farther, Faster and Flatter then ever before.

Web Page: www.apsrifles.com

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