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Boosting BC of commerical bullets.....

 
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  #43  
Old 03-19-2013, 09:12 AM
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Re: Boosting BC of commerical bullets.....

Hey Kirby, also another question....Kinda off topic, but similar.

I have several boxes of the factory loaded ammo of the Federal Premium P7RK, which is the 160gr Barnes XLC coated Triple-Shocks. Is it possible to remove the XLC coating, If not, how bad does it stick into the rifling? I used to shoot them out of my old A-Bolt II 7Mag that got stolen back in 08, but I haven't shot any out of my new A-Bolt II 7Mag, since it seems to really like the Accubonds.

Also, is the XLC coating like the Lubolox coating, which is actually thick enough to make the bullets .284 diameter, b/c the bullet is cast a tiny bit smaller than that, so the coating helps make up the proper diameter? Unlike Moly, which is super thin and just barely coats a properly sized and cast bullet?

Once again, sorry to derail, just always wondered that.
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Originally Posted by WildRose View Post
The 284 is to the STW what a tricycle is to a Ninja.
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  #44  
Old 03-19-2013, 10:12 AM
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Re: Boosting BC of commerical bullets.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by MudRunner2005 View Post
Hey Kirby, also another question....Kinda off topic, but similar.

I have several boxes of the factory loaded ammo of the Federal Premium P7RK, which is the 160gr Barnes XLC coated Triple-Shocks. Is it possible to remove the XLC coating, If not, how bad does it stick into the rifling? I used to shoot them out of my old A-Bolt II 7Mag that got stolen back in 08, but I haven't shot any out of my new A-Bolt II 7Mag, since it seems to really like the Accubonds.

Also, is the XLC coating like the Lubolox coating, which is actually thick enough to make the bullets .284 diameter, b/c the bullet is cast a tiny bit smaller than that, so the coating helps make up the proper diameter? Unlike Moly, which is super thin and just barely coats a properly sized and cast bullet?

Once again, sorry to derail, just always wondered that.
I believe the XLC has a topical coating applied to the bullets. Some short of dry film application. You may be able to put them in a brass tumbler and it may come off. The new stainless steel tumbling media would probably remove it.

The Lubolox coating is not really a coating, its an oxidation process that is supposed to hardern the outer surface of the bullet to reduce friction with the bore. In the process, it turns the surface of the bullet black. This can not be removed without removing metal from the bullet.

I have not really noticed either coating a barrel with use as long as you stay on top of regular cleaning.
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  #45  
Old 03-19-2013, 10:28 AM
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Re: Boosting BC of commerical bullets.....

Thanks Kirby. I have been curious. I remember cleaning my old A-Bolt after shooting those bullets and constantly patchcing blue stuff out of the barrel. LOL It could have also been the Hoppes #9 bore cleaning solvent reacting to the solid copper Barnes TSX bullets... That's why I was curious. I might go shoot one of them at the range and clean with Kroil just to see if it leaves any blue on my patches this time.

Thanks again....Your knowledge overpowers mine to the embarrassing point. You are like the Gun Yoda.
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"I'm just a peckerwood who lives in the hills with too many guns..." - Bob Lee Swagger

"Give me a minute...I'm good. Give me an hour...I'm great. Give me 6 months...And I'm unbeatable." - Col. Hannibal Smith

Ignore everything I say, because I have a reading comprehension and memory problem...

Quote:
Originally Posted by WildRose View Post
The 284 is to the STW what a tricycle is to a Ninja.
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  #46  
Old 03-19-2013, 12:15 PM
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Re: Boosting BC of commerical bullets.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiftydriver View Post
Once I had the collet system made, it took me around 15 minutes to figure out the correct amount to take off the ogive to match up to the tip diameter. That number is a given that can be repeated quickly from set up to set up so that is not something that needs to be done every time I set up.

Once I got a few ran and figured out the process, I timed myself to see how long it would take just or my information from a labor stand point just in case I ever decided to offer these bullets for sale(still undecided on that).

On the conventional cup jackted bullets, After a bit of time I could pump out between 2 and 3 a minute. So your looking at around 120 to 180 per hour. I am sure it would get quicker with more time and I can see possibly pushing this up to around 4 per minute pretty easily with so time and practice.

The simple version of the process goes like this:

1. Release the 6 jaw chuck pressure, insert a bullet into the collet, tighten down the chuck.

2. Use my part off tool which is set up in the correct position to take the correct amount of the ogive off the bullet. Part off the nose of the bullet at 430 rpms

3. Take some 0000 steel wool and remove the small burr left on the bullet by the part off cutter while the lathe is spinning at same rpm.

4. Use a small center drill to make a starter hole in the face of the larger bullet meplat. Not deep, only around 25 thou is plenty. Same 430 rpm

5. Replace center drill with #40 carbide drill (not needed for lead) and drill 0.098" diameter hole 0.400" deep into the nose of the bullet. Same 430 rpm

6. Run part off tool across face of bullet again to remove any left over lead scraps from drilling process.

7. Turn off lathe, insert 22 cal bullet seater stem into chuck in tail rest. Insert aluminum tip onto hole in bullet and use the tail stock to press in the tip into the nose cavity of the bullet. Done and repeat for next bullet.

the Barnes bullets are harder to do and I need to order in some different tooling to make it easier to do them. The solid copper bullets really like to gaul up so if you push the drill to hard then stick pretty tight so you have to go slower with these by a little bit. The tips have a 0.101" diameter shank post and in the lead bullets, the 0.004" press fit is perfect, on the solid copper bullets, its to heavy so I need to order in a drill with a 0.100" diameter which should be perfect for the Barnes bullets. Other then that, its the same process.

Again, not hard at all, anyone with a lathe and a bit of time can do this easily. I am going to sit down and sometime and try to figure out a system that could be used for a drill press as there are more guys that have a drill press then have a metal lathe. I think it could be easily done, just have to figure out the clamping system on the bullet, other then that it would be easy.

In fact, it may be better on a drill press as far as pressing tips in as well.
Thanks Kirby you should give consideration to building a tool much like the case trimmers offered for bulk brass (this would make this possible for everyone). Like a big electric pencil sharpener, make sure you patented it and give me some credit. You can call one of the parts the "Morehouse" gear, chuck, spindle what ever.

Jon
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  #47  
Old 03-19-2013, 12:27 PM
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Re: Boosting BC of commerical bullets.....

I am trying to figure out a fixture and process as simple as possible and affordable as possible as well so that I may offer it to the public so they can do their own. Just starting the process now and wanted to share the results so far.

I am sure there will be much more to come.
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Kirby Allen(50)

Allen Precision Shooting
Home of the Allen Magnum, Allen Xpress and Allen Tactical Wildcats and the Painkiller Muzzle brakes.

Farther, Faster and Flatter then ever before.

Web Page: www.apsrifles.com

allenmagnum@gmail.com
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  #48  
Old 03-19-2013, 01:19 PM
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Re: Boosting BC of commerical bullets.....

With teh AB's, do you have to pull the white tip out, then grind it down, then press the new AL tip in?
__________________
"I'm just a peckerwood who lives in the hills with too many guns..." - Bob Lee Swagger

"Give me a minute...I'm good. Give me an hour...I'm great. Give me 6 months...And I'm unbeatable." - Col. Hannibal Smith

Ignore everything I say, because I have a reading comprehension and memory problem...

Quote:
Originally Posted by WildRose View Post
The 284 is to the STW what a tricycle is to a Ninja.
Reply With Quote
  #49  
Old 03-19-2013, 04:05 PM
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Re: Boosting BC of commerical bullets.....

Tip pretty much comes off when you part off the nose. I found that if you part off the nose and the tip, it leaves a portion of the white tip still in the nose cavity of the bullet, they if you center drill this plastic and then drill through it and into the lead, it holds the aluminum tip better then if you remove the internal portion of the tip all together.

More testing to come but that is what seems to work best so far.
__________________
Kirby Allen(50)

Allen Precision Shooting
Home of the Allen Magnum, Allen Xpress and Allen Tactical Wildcats and the Painkiller Muzzle brakes.

Farther, Faster and Flatter then ever before.

Web Page: www.apsrifles.com

allenmagnum@gmail.com
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