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Barnes LRX TTSX, which one??

 
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  #15  
Old 12-06-2012, 12:52 PM
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Re: Barnes LRX TTSX, which one??

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Originally Posted by Tikkamike View Post
...
and a 110 or a 130 hitting elk bone is going to not be nearly as effective as the heavier bullets. energy is a number but it isnt whe whole equation. the very low sectional density makes the 110 and 130 and in my opinion the 165 very poor choices for elk
^^ Ditto, Sectional Density (along with rotational velocity) dictates penetration characteristics. On heavy bone, I will take Sectional Density all day every day. I'm a Barnes shooter just like Mike, so don't think i'm bashing. The light fellers will do the job up TO elk, then you enter another weight class entirely. They are FAR tougher & much more heavily constructed than any 'lope or deer every imagined. Go heavy, break bone & bring home your trophy. Every time.


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  #16  
Old 12-06-2012, 01:07 PM
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Re: Barnes LRX TTSX, which one??

500yd,

I don't know where you are gettin your information from but it is incorrect. The 200 TSX and the 200 LRX have a deeper hollow point cavity than does the 130 or 110 TSX.

Also, the lighter bullet will shed all of its energy a lot quicker than the heavier bullet when it goes through the animal. So if both bullets hit bone, the heavier bullet will in theory perform better in order to punch through heavy bone on an elk.

I will agree with you though that Barnes are some great bullets.
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  #17  
Old 12-06-2012, 06:44 PM
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Re: Barnes LRX TTSX, which one??

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Originally Posted by Korhil78 View Post
Also a really light bullet going really fast will wear your barrel out faster than the slower, heavier bullet. Again..this is all just my opinion.
This can go either way, some say since the bullet is going slower it spends more time in the barrel allowing the hot gases to attack the rifling longer therefore giveing shorter barrel life, but on the other hand a lighter bullet is going to cause more friction from moving faster. So its a tossup.

And to the OP, go heavy! a 200 grain LRX will kill anything in NA.
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  #18  
Old 12-07-2012, 12:38 AM
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Re: Barnes LRX TTSX, which one??

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Originally Posted by Tikkamike View Post
actually you are wrong, the ogive of the LRX is not the same as your tsx series bullets I have some 200LRX and have cut one in half along with other TSX bullets and the expansion chamber is deeper and the nose is longer.
I'll have to take your word for it as I don't have cutaways myself. However, the difference in 'mushroom' diameter is going to be small, and not yield a significantly larger wound channel, as I stated above.

Quote:
and a 110 or a 130 hitting elk bone is going to not be nearly as effective as the heavier bullets. energy is a number but it isnt whe whole equation. the very low sectional density makes the 110 and 130 and in my opinion the 165 very poor choices for elk
Yes, there are many factors in the penetration equation. Energy and SD both play a role. Interestingly, if the 200 LRX you mention does indeed have a much higher petal mushroom diameter, then this actually decreases its SD advantage over the 110/130 zippers after impact. This is because the 200 grain mass is distributed over a larger cross sectional area. To illustrate, terminal SD is precisely why a 147 gr 7.62x51 ball round will sail right through an elk, bone and all, at 500 yds, and keep on truck'n. It doesn't expand at all, so it's terminal SD doesn't change. The terminal SD of expanding rounds will drop by a factor of at least 3 due to mushroom in the case of the TTSX/LRX, and around 6 for standard lead bullets that have a uniform mushroom surface.

Thus, if you want maximum penetration, you want your bullet expanding less, not more. However, penetration isn't the only factor in the kill equation. As I mentioned previously, cavitation creates your wound channel and transfers bullet energy into the body. A larger mushroom diameter is going to create more cavitation, more shock, and a larger wound channel. However, cavitation is more a function of velocity than cross sectional area, so again, the faster X bullets have a small edge here, at least to 500 yds. Above that the 200 is retaining more velocity thus energy, thus more cavitation.

I do agree that field circumstances don't always allow for perfect shot placement, so maybe the extra 500 ft-lbs of the LRX 200 at 500 yds vs the 110, or the extra 300 ft-lbs over the 130, could mean the difference between a running injured elk and a hobbling injured elk which, like deer, is much easier to pump that 2nd shot into. The X bullet design and the math demonstrate that the zippers should be just as effective as the freight train with proper shot placement. I guess this debate can only be settled with field experience. Unfortunately I don't own and do not plant to purchase a 300 WM/WSM, and I won't be travelling West for an elk hunt any time soon. It'll be up to others to test these rounds in the field.
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  #19  
Old 12-14-2012, 12:05 AM
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Re: Barnes LRX TTSX, which one??

I will start by saying that in my 10 twist 3 groove Lilja barrel the 175 LRX is terrible to try to get shooting, but the 168 tsx and 165 ttsx is 1/2 moa bullet for me. I am just sure that all the experts here arguing this topic have killed a ton of elk and seen the results of their choosen projectile.

I am sure that in a perfect world a guy could kill an elk with a 204 at 100 yards! In fact I know a rancher that does it every year. I is not gonna to do it! I know that a 25-06 will kill an elk in an alfalfa field when they are all balled up and a pass through is not wanted because I have done it multiple times.

In my opinion for long range hunting you better consider wind, distance, and obstructions. When you hit a 3/4 inch branch (that you can not see at distance) with a very light bullet, and you cripple a great big bull elk and have to kill it before it gets away you had better be prepared to shoot it in the ass if you have to, and kill it before you never see it again.

I am by no means a long range expert, but I have guided to lots of hundreds of elk, mostly cows, and so in this category, I can really and fairly feel like I can say I have witnessed a lot of peoples elk murdering ideas and lots of failures. If I could count how many children and women have killed their crippled elk with my 308 and 180 grain bullets at over 500 yards, after the hot rod rifle they were using was not the answer, it would tally more dead elk then most people will kill in a lifetime.
A person can sit on a computer and dial up any combo you want to, but I will take a big heavy bullet and some target knobs any day of the season.
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  #20  
Old 12-14-2012, 02:21 AM
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Re: Barnes LRX TTSX, which one??

Quote:
Originally Posted by rooster740 View Post
I will start by saying that in my 10 twist 3 groove Lilja barrel the 175 LRX is terrible to try to get shooting, but the 168 tsx and 165 ttsx is 1/2 moa bullet for me. I am just sure that all the experts here arguing this topic have killed a ton of elk and seen the results of their choosen projectile.

I am sure that in a perfect world a guy could kill an elk with a 204 at 100 yards! In fact I know a rancher that does it every year. I is not gonna to do it! I know that a 25-06 will kill an elk in an alfalfa field when they are all balled up and a pass through is not wanted because I have done it multiple times.

In my opinion for long range hunting you better consider wind, distance, and obstructions. When you hit a 3/4 inch branch (that you can not see at distance) with a very light bullet, and you cripple a great big bull elk and have to kill it before it gets away you had better be prepared to shoot it in the ass if you have to, and kill it before you never see it again.

I am by no means a long range expert, but I have guided to lots of hundreds of elk, mostly cows, and so in this category, I can really and fairly feel like I can say I have witnessed a lot of peoples elk murdering ideas and lots of failures. If I could count how many children and women have killed their crippled elk with my 308 and 180 grain bullets at over 500 yards, after the hot rod rifle they were using was not the answer, it would tally more dead elk then most people will kill in a lifetime.
A person can sit on a computer and dial up any combo you want to, but I will take a big heavy bullet and some target knobs any day of the season.
Exactly
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  #21  
Old 12-14-2012, 09:11 AM
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Re: Barnes LRX TTSX, which one??

Quote:
Originally Posted by rooster740 View Post
I am by no means a long range expert, but I have guided to lots of hundreds of elk, mostly cows, and so in this category, I can really and fairly feel like I can say I have witnessed a lot of peoples elk murdering ideas and lots of failures. If I could count how many children and women have killed their crippled elk with my 308 and 180 grain bullets at over 500 yards, after the hot rod rifle they were using was not the answer, it would tally more dead elk then most people will kill in a lifetime.
A person can sit on a computer and dial up any combo you want to, but I will take a big heavy bullet and some target knobs any day of the season..

Bingo!! We have a winner!!!!


Jeff
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