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Barnes Data...Conservative?

 
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  #1  
Old 03-10-2009, 07:17 PM
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Barnes Data...Conservative?

Hi Guys, Haven't said much lately, but I have a question. I'm loading a .338 RUM, 225 TTSX, with Retumbo and RL-22 as starting powders. I've selected the charges I am going to start with, but in some research, I find loads up to 6 grains over Barnes published max. I know there are a ton of variables, but 6 grains? Is Barnes THAT conservative? mtmuley
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Old 03-15-2009, 01:34 AM
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Re: Barnes Data...Conservative?

IMO, all manuals are very conservative and are simply starting points.
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Old 03-15-2009, 05:11 PM
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Re: Barnes Data...Conservative?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mtmuley View Post
Hi Guys, Haven't said much lately, but I have a question. I'm loading a .338 RUM, 225 TTSX, with Retumbo and RL-22 as starting powders. I've selected the charges I am going to start with, but in some research, I find loads up to 6 grains over Barnes published max. I know there are a ton of variables, but 6 grains? Is Barnes THAT conservative? mtmuley
Saftey first sir.

Solid copper bullets even the TSX generate MORE pressure than most jacketed lead bullets. You will see similar velocities as jacketed lead with less powder under a solid copper bullet.

Even then you still cant always load to book max. Book max is typically for factory specs. When you use tight tolerence custom barrels and tight cut chambers pressures go up even more.
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Old 03-15-2009, 06:56 PM
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Re: Barnes Data...Conservative?

[QUOTE=meichele; Solid copper bullets even the TSX generate MORE pressure than most jacketed lead bullets.

i'm going to disagree with the second part of this statement. full bearing surface length bullets that are solid copper will generally develope more pressure. but the solids with the grooves(TXS) or a banded style of bullet won't. reason being the copper is softer on solids as compared to the copper used for jackets with cup and core bullets.the grooves allow some place for the metal to go and it's easier for the bullet to engage in the rifling. this is the reason groove/banded style of bullets can be driven to higher velocities.
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Old 03-15-2009, 06:59 PM
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Re: Barnes Data...Conservative?

Safety first is the order of the day as michele stated. All manuals load to the SAAMI max Average pressure limit in their test barrels which may or may not top out at max the same as your barrel and powder, bullets, etc..
Powder from lot to lot may have a different burn rate. Hogden claims that they maintain a + or - 3%. So if you get one lot that is on the 3% fast side and another lot that is on the 3% slow side that's a 6% swing.
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Old 03-15-2009, 07:31 PM
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Re: Barnes Data...Conservative?

Quote:
Originally Posted by davewilson View Post
i'm going to disagree with the second part of this statement. full bearing surface length bullets that are solid copper will generally develope more pressure. but the solids with the grooves(TXS) or a banded style of bullet won't. reason being the copper is softer on solids as compared to the copper used for jackets with cup and core bullets.the grooves allow some place for the metal to go and it's easier for the bullet to engage in the rifling. this is the reason groove/banded style of bullets can be driven to higher velocities.
All I know is that in each case I have used the TSX bullets I have had to reduce the powder to get the same velocities as most jacketed lead bullets. My latest loads are 4.0 grains less than the 180 ACCUBOND even though the AB's are shoved into the lands and the TSX's are .02" off. Whatever the reason. I dont know why.
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Long range shooting is a process that ends with a result. Once you start to focus on the result (where the shot goes, how big the group is, what your buck will score, what your match score is, what place you are in...) then you loose the capacity to focus on the process.

Last edited by Michael Eichele; 03-15-2009 at 07:35 PM.
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Old 03-15-2009, 07:41 PM
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Re: Barnes Data...Conservative?

Quote:
Originally Posted by meichele View Post
All I know is that in each case I have used the TSX bullets I have had to reduce the powder to get the same velocities as most jacketed lead bullets. My latest loads are 4.0 grains less than the 180 ACCUBOND even though the AB's are shoved into the lands and the TSX's are .02" off. Whatever the reason. I dont know why.
Here is a perfect example showing that each set of components will show different results in different barrels. I have shot 180 AccuBonds, and 180 TSX in my 300 RUM over the same powder charge and velocities were within 20 FPS of each other. This was before the Barnes load data came out for the TSX and my load is over the top Barnes Load. I had no detectable over pressure sign, I may or may not have been over pressure no way to know without pressure testing equipment.
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