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6.5 saum

 
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  #15  
Old 08-26-2013, 12:15 AM
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Re: 6.5 saum

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Originally Posted by 65WSM View Post
I have cycled through 3 barrels in 6.5 WSM and am getting another replaced at the riflesmith as we speak.


One of my WSMs is nitrocarburized and the other is not. I treat all bullets with HBN which all but eliminates copper fouling.
What load/velocity are you running through them? How many rounds are the barrels lasting to what degree of accuracy? And is the nitrocarburizng increasing barrel life?
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  #16  
Old 08-26-2013, 12:17 PM
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Re: 6.5 saum

I like 65.5 to 66.5 gr of Retumbo with magnum primers behind 140 gr bullets and up to 68 gr of Retumbo (3170 fps) with 130 gr Nosler ABs (3280 fps). I have 2 different barrels, twists and lengths. I will send you my spreadsheet if you send me your e-mail. A full 3200 with 140 gr bullets is tough on primer pockets. I come from a background of pre-64 Model 70s in .264 Win Mag. I had two of them and wore out the factory and replacement Kriegers. The .264 Win Mag holds about 5 grains more powder to get the same pressure and will go faster than the 6.5 WSM in the same barrel. I wish I had Retumbo when I had my pre-64s instead of surplus 4831. I did back flips when Reloader 22 became available. The best they ever did was 1.25" at 100 yards with 3-9X scopes.

I have not worn out a nitrocarburized barrel yet. I am between 500 to 600 rounds so far through my one nitrocarburized barrel in this caliber. No signs of damage yet. It is fun to clean -- so smooooth. I can get under 4 inch groups at the 550 length of my club range with a 8-32X56 Black Diamond. My synthetic stocked (MPI) Model 70 weighs 7.6 pounds with a 2.5-10X32 scope and sling ready to hunt. Add more weight for a load development scope. The Highwall weighs 2 pounds more but some of that is scope.

I have a 6.5-284 that is in the Riflesmiths vise today to be rebarreled. The current Bartlein 5-r gain twist is being replaced at about 850 rounds. I think that 1200 rounds is optimistic if they go at hunting speed. I can get 130 ABs in the 6.5-284 to go just as fast as out of the 6.5 WSM with VV N560 powder. I will nitrocarburize the replacement barrel.
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  #17  
Old 08-26-2013, 12:24 PM
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Re: 6.5 saum

I like 65.5 to 66.5 gr of Retumbo with magnum primers behind 140 gr bullets and up to 68 gr of Retumbo (3170 fps) with 130 gr Nosler ABs (3280 fps). I have 2 different barrels, twists and lengths. I will send you my spreadsheet if you send me your e-mail. A full 3200 with 140 gr bullets is tough on primer pockets. I come from a background of pre-64 Model 70s in .264 Win Mag. I had two of them and wore out the factory and replacement Kriegers. The .264 Win Mag holds about 5 grains more powder to get the same pressure and will go faster than the 6.5 WSM in the same barrel. I wish I had Retumbo when I had my pre-64s instead of surplus 4831. I did back flips when Reloader 22 became available. The best they ever did was 1.25" at 100 yards with 3-9X scopes.

I have not worn out a nitrocarburized barrel yet. I am between 500 to 600 rounds so far through my one nitrocarburized barrel in this caliber. No signs of damage yet. It is fun to clean -- so smooooth. I can get under 4 inch groups at the 550 length of my club range with a 8-32X56 Black Diamond. My synthetic stocked (MPI) Model 70 weighs 7.6 pounds with a 2.5-10X32 scope and sling ready to hunt. Add more weight for a load development scope. The Highwall weighs 2 pounds more but some of that is scope.

I have a 6.5-284 that is in the Riflesmiths vise today to be rebarreled. The current Bartlein 5-r gain twist is being replaced at about 850 rounds. I think that 1200 rounds is optimistic if they go at hunting speed. I can get 130 ABs in the 6.5-284 to go just as fast as out of the 6.5 WSM with VV N560 powder. I will nitrocarburize the replacement barrel.
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  #18  
Old 08-26-2013, 01:34 PM
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Re: 6.5 saum

Quote:
Originally Posted by 65WSM View Post
I like 65.5 to 66.5 gr of Retumbo with magnum primers behind 140 gr bullets and up to 68 gr of Retumbo (3170 fps) with 130 gr Nosler ABs (3280 fps). I have 2 different barrels, twists and lengths. I will send you my spreadsheet if you send me your e-mail. A full 3200 with 140 gr bullets is tough on primer pockets. I come from a background of pre-64 Model 70s in .264 Win Mag. I had two of them and wore out the factory and replacement Kriegers. The .264 Win Mag holds about 5 grains more powder to get the same pressure and will go faster than the 6.5 WSM in the same barrel. I wish I had Retumbo when I had my pre-64s instead of surplus 4831. I did back flips when Reloader 22 became available. The best they ever did was 1.25" at 100 yards with 3-9X scopes.

I have not worn out a nitrocarburized barrel yet. I am between 500 to 600 rounds so far through my one nitrocarburized barrel in this caliber. No signs of damage yet. It is fun to clean -- so smooooth. I can get under 4 inch groups at the 550 length of my club range with a 8-32X56 Black Diamond. My synthetic stocked (MPI) Model 70 weighs 7.6 pounds with a 2.5-10X32 scope and sling ready to hunt. Add more weight for a load development scope. The Highwall weighs 2 pounds more but some of that is scope.

I have a 6.5-284 that is in the Riflesmiths vise today to be rebarreled. The current Bartlein 5-r gain twist is being replaced at about 850 rounds. I think that 1200 rounds is optimistic if they go at hunting speed. I can get 130 ABs in the 6.5-284 to go just as fast as out of the 6.5 WSM with VV N560 powder. I will nitrocarburize the replacement barrel.
Thanks for the info. I am sending my 6.5 WSM barrel and action, along with a couple of other barrels and actions for nitriding this week. I hope the benefits are as good as I'm reading. Sounds like it's working good for you. What company did you use for your treatment? I'll PM you my email.
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  #19  
Old 08-26-2013, 04:06 PM
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Re: 6.5 saum

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Originally Posted by Mikecr View Post
See the thing is, 'sub moa' is not at all accurate...
Loaded up to potential, I'm sure the 6.5saum from a GAP gun is truly accurate(well under 1/2moa) -AND THERE IS GREATLY REDUCED BARREL LIFE THERE.
Don't trick yourself, pick one or the other, and accept that there is a price for everything.
George (owner of GAP) won the snipers hide cup with 3000+ rounds down the tube so I would say that is loaded to potential. He has shot lots of comps with it so it has not been babied at all seems that bbl life is not that reduced
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  #20  
Old 08-26-2013, 06:58 PM
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Re: 6.5 saum

Loaded to potential when he shot so well with it -no doubt.
NOT when breaking a 'world 26cal barrel life record' with it..
Just sayin

It has the same H20 capacity as a 6.5x284.
Over the decades many many have competed with a 6.5x284, and it's done well.
Accurate Barrel life: 1200rnds
Unless his barrels are Melonite treated, I doubt he's bettering this.

Even the mighty mouse 6.5x47L will not produce beyond ~2000 rounds of accurate barrel life.
Just watch the numbers come in..
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  #21  
Old 08-26-2013, 09:20 PM
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Re: 6.5 saum

Kurt,

I do not for one second doubt that George won that competion with said barrel and said round count.

That said, as an innocent bystander and student of science, how is it that two different cartridges of same caliber and capacity have such huge differences in historical/predicted barrel life? Being a holder of a couple of science degrees and generally disposed to that sort of thinking, it greatly puzzles me.

As a student of science, I also know that many variables can confuse the apparent result and so it is necessary to exercise controls over the experiment.

Based on my limited knowledge of the shooting sports and laws of nature, I would say one, there are always exceptions to the rule and two, the observed outcomes resulting from the laws of nature are hard to deny.

Bottom line..... there is usually no free lunch If you like the 6.5 WSM, go for it. but if you are of the opinion that you are going to get 3000 rounds of high performance accuracy, be prepared to be disappointed.

I am going the 6.5 WSM route and completely understand what's expected. That said. I'm hedging my bets on a treatment that may increase my expectations.... but am prepared for whatever
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