6-284 long range antelope load

[Fiftydriver]

Iron worker,

First the name of my business is:

Allen Precision Shooting
#99 Stevenson Rd.
Fort Shaw, MT 59443

Personally, as an extreme accuracy minded gunsmith, I prefer the Remington but only on the basis of building on those actions.

As far as factory rifles go and using them as they come out of the box, the Sako rifles have no flies on them at all.

I like the looks of a Rem 700 over a Sako but I will freely admit that on average, the Sako would probably shoot a bit better then a stock Rem.

That said, with both rifles are tuned and tweaked to extract top accuracy potential, the Rem will win hands down simply because of the huge array of aftermarket products designed to increase the accuracy and consistancy of the Rem 700 rifles.

I have played with the 700 LV a little. The one I shot was a 22-250 as well. My feelings are that they are definately light and one could easily carry them a fair ways but I feel they are just a bit to light. I like the stability of a little weight, even in a walking varmitn rifle.

My personal walking varminter is a Ruger M77 stainless/laminated sporter with a 22" factoy barrel. loaded with the 40 gr Ballistic Tip at 4100 fps, it has few peers when it comes to popping critters up to the size of big coyotes out as far as I will ever need to shoot with such a rifle.

Still if I were to build myself a walking varminter, it would be a 700 short action with a 24" Lilja #2 or #3 contour and stocked in a Holland Signature laminated sporter stock.

The chambering would either be a 223 rem AI or the 22-250 AI.

The 700 LV I shot was a decent shooter, I did not measure groups but I would say it averaged less them moa which for such a light weight rifle is not all bad from the factory.

Still, from a factory list of rifle, the actual differences would be very slim comparing the Rem and the Sako. Its really a personal preference thing.

I would go with a little heavier rifle such as the standard 700 sporter over the LV. Just like a little more weight even for a walking rifle.

Good Shooting!!

Kirby (50)

[lead foot]

Sorry I'm late, just saw this.

I get a sense, from my rifle and a couple others, that the 6x.284 doesn't give as much more velocity as you'd expect with heavy bullets and fast twists. A shooter I know has identical .243 AI and 6x.284 rifles set up with 1-8" twists for 105 to 107 grain bullets. The .243 AI only falls 50 fps or less short unless he chooses to start blowing primers out of the 6x.284 cases. I've heard of people trying to get high velocity out of fast twist, large capacity 6.5s having the same problems so I'm not overly surprised.

When you lighten the bullets a bit and slow the twist down, the 6x.284 starts to scream. I used to push 70 grain ballistic tips at just a hair under 3900 fps with a 1-14" twist, 58 (I think) grains of RL19, Federal 210M primers, and reformed Lapua 6.5x.284 cases. I'd sometimes change to the 65 grain VMAX with the same load, or increase the load by 1 grain and go to the 58 grain VMAX.

The 58 grain load was viscious for the first couple hundred yards. The 70 grain load was the most accurate. But I was using the 65 grain load when I made my longest hit, about 435 yards.

Anyway, I have a theory, untested, that to get top velocity out of a bullet as long as the 105 or 107 VLDs and a quick twist, you've got to use some sort of coating to overcome friction or you'll run into intermittent pressure excursions.

[Fiftydriver]

T.O.M.,

I would not totally disagree with your comments but I do feel that a properly fitted and chambered 6mm-284 will produce at least 150 fps more velocity the the 243 AI of equal barrel length and chamber quality.

The problem us that most loaders use the wrong powder for the 6mm-284 and as a result will not get full velocity potential.

THe large cased small bore rounds are a tricky bunch to get working to full velocity.

I recently built a 6mm-06 for a customer and when doing the barrel break in he also did some liad developement.

This rifle wore a 28.5" Kreiger barrel with a 1-9 twist. He was getting 4400 fps with the 55 gr Ballsitic Tips and getting groups in the 1's and 2's at that velocity.

The rifle was designed for the 105 gr A-Max and once the barrel was broke in be tested that round and was getting +3600 fps with groups in the 3's out of the 28.5" barrel.

I am getting 3550 fps out of my 6mm-284 with the 107 gr Mk with its 1-8 twist 30" Lilja barrel, using coated bullets.

I have never seen any 243 AI or 6mm AI get anything over 3400 and 3500 fps respectively out of a 28 to 30" barrel.

That is not to say it is not possible to get a very fast 243 AI and a slow barreled 6mm-284.

What velocities are your friend getting with both rounds? I would be curious if he is driving the 6mm-284 where he should be with the correct powders.

Like I said, the big cased small bores have a much narrower powder selection that will produce top velocities, especially compered to the 243 AI.

Another problem is if he is using Lapua 6.5-284 brass to form cases out of. This brass is very top quality but also very soft and he WILL burn it up in very few firings even with near top level loads.

THe Norma brass is the same way. Most Wby cases will gie up the ghost on the 2nd or 3rd firing with full tilt loads simply because teh brass is so soft.

I use Win brass only in my 6mm-284's. It is not as quality from the box as the European brass, but after an hour at the bench sorting and machining the win brass, it will make the foreign stuff look pretty bad.

It is also much harder brass and will survive much higher pressure loads for much longer. IT also machines much cleaner then the stickier, softer foreign brass and also cost half as much.

Hornady brass is alright but the Win brass is the stoutest I have used in the 284 class wildcats and all I will recommend for the reasons you list.

Good Shooting!!

Kirby Allen(50)

[lead foot]

I wasn't involved with the load development on those faster twist rifles so I can't say for sure firsthand, what was reported to me was velocities around 3200 fps when the primer pockets started opening up. That isn't very impressive. I have no idea what powders they were using. In the normal (whatever is trendy) way of things, they've pretty much moved from 6mm to 6.5mm for their longer range paper punchers now.

[Fiftydriver]

T.O.M.,

I agree the 6.5 is a more consistant extreme range performer, especially when dealing with a little wind.

3200 fps is about what I would say is normal velocity from a 26" or so barrel for the 243 AI using the 105-107 gr bullets.

3250 is extremely slow for a 6mm-284 with the same bullets even out of a 24" pipe.

I suspect your friend was using fast powders in hopes of accuracy improvements. Most of the BR guys will prefer powders on the fast burn rate saying they produce a slight edge in cutting group size.

This may full well be as the know more then I on the matter of BR matches but for big cased, small bored rounds, you are taking the legs out from under them if you use fast powders which are suited for much smaller case capacities.

Good Shooting!!

Kirby Allen(50)

[brian b]

fiftydriver,dakor,T.O.M,ironworker,
I have been a dedicated 6-284 fan for several year's,your banter back and forth
has been very interesting if not disturbing
to say the least,I just have to state my
experience's. I have my second 6-284 with
it's second barrel on it a pac-nor 1-8"
29.5" 3 groove 1.200straight taper. I started
out shooting 105 berger's out of my new barrel but if I exceded 3200fps. they would
blow up.the lapua 105 scenars shot O.K. but
I finally decided on the sierra 107mk's
and have been happy ever since.the problem I
have is that I keep reading that somebody
is shooting these at 3600fps,what brand of
chronograph are you using ???? mine is an
oehler 35p that tell's me that my 6-284 .272
neck 50.0gr. rl22 lapua brass,gm210 primer
107gr MK is going 3348 s.d.8
Please tell me how to make mine go 3600
Even as slow as all mine have been I have
still had some varmint hunting success with
them,weekend before last me and my nephew
both attained our shooting goal's for the
summer by shooting a rockchuck at 1500yard's
I do have to admit that my nephew's 6.5-
284 did a slightly better job,that inspired
me to start a 338Lapua Imp.project for next
year's mile quest.
One question that I must ask of you,do you
have any hard carbon deposit issues with
your 6-284's and if so what is the easiest
way to clean it out.
1500yds. 64shot's 1 kill

[dakor]

Brian I have shot mine through several different chrony's and I had pretty much the same velocity maybe a 30 to 40 fps difference. A 6mm-284 will eat a 243 or a 6mm ackley for lunch and then some especialy with bullets over 85 grains or more. I have a 9 twist I can shoot 70gr Bergers at over 4000 fps and 80's at 3900fps and 100's at 3500+ FPS. The biggest mistake people make with a overbore cartridge like the 6mm-284 is they seat the bullet into the lands so you cannot load it as hot. If I seat my bullets into the lands I lose anywhere for 100fps to 150fps. I shoot mine off the lands 30 thousands and I do not see any difference in accuracy it is a quarter inch gun loaded on the lands or off the lands. If you cannot get at least 3400fps with a 100 gr bullet with out pressure you either are using the wrong powder or you have the bullets to deep in the lands. As for testing velocity I also check it by how low I am at 500 yards with a 300 yards zero that is one sure way to check your FPS.