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338 lapua v. 338-378 weatherby

 
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  #1  
Old 12-08-2004, 06:48 PM
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338 lapua v. 338-378 weatherby

I am looking at getting a tactical H S precision rifle in either 338 lapua or 338-378 weatherby. Which caliber is more accurate at ranges out to 800 + yards? Is either caliber traditionally more accurate than the other or am I just burning more powder with the weatherby caliber?
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Old 12-09-2004, 03:49 PM
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Re: 338 lapua v. 338-378 weatherby

Christopher,

Being a accuracy minded rifle builder, it is of my opinion that if two rifles are built to the smae match grade quality in two different chamberings such as the two you list, there will be no difference in accuracy potential.

I believe it is teh rifle that makes the accuracy not the round.

The 338 Lapua was designed for long range shooting in mind for military purposes. The 338-378 was designed simply to provide teh biggest baddest factory 338 available, basically Wby's reason for all of their rounds.

That said, the 338-378 is a great round if you can handle the recoil and with a quality brake they are easy to control.

While the 338 Lapua is certainly a large magnum round, it is not even in the same class as the 338-378 Wby. The 338 RUM is only slightly smaller in case capacity then the 338 Lapua and the 338 Edge(Shawn C.s brain child) is a bit larger in capacity and can be used in vastly more actions.

Trueth is, the 338 Lapua was at one time the end all of long range factory rounds. Now it is near the top but there are cheaper and higher performance wounds out there.

The 338-378 will do with 250 gr bullets what the 338 Lapua will do with 225 gr pills. Or it will give you around 150 to 200 fps more velocity with the same bullet weights.

As far as accuracy, I built myself a 338 Kahn which is basically an improved 338-378 Wby with conventional 35 degree shoulder. This round is roughly 10 gr larger incapacity then the 338-378 parent case. Yesterday, I landed two 300 gr Wildcat ULDs within 3" at 1300 yards just to see how they would group at that range.

In a quality built rifle, either round will flat smoke in performance and accuracy potential.

At extreme range the velocity advantage of the 338-378 is not a huge deal to worry about. Just a little more of the same good old thing.

Good Shooting!!

Kirby Allen(50)
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Kirby Allen(50)

Allen Precision Shooting
Home of the Allen Magnum, Allen Xpress and Allen Tactical Wildcats and the Painkiller Muzzle brakes.

Farther, Faster and Flatter then ever before.

Web Page: www.apsrifles.com

allenmagnum@gmail.com
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Old 12-09-2004, 07:19 PM
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Re: 338 lapua v. 338-378 weatherby

I was willing to spend somewhere around $2500 and am currious what anybody thinks about the HS Precision rifles. I am not set on this rifle. Are there any other rifles that I may want to look at?
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Old 12-10-2004, 08:27 AM
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Re: 338 lapua v. 338-378 weatherby

H-S Precision rifles are quality rifles but let me make one comment about them. They say their sub 30 caliber rifles will shoot 1/2 moa which is certainly very good. They do not say at what range they will hold this accuracy level but I assume its a 100 yard standard.

For any round over 30 cal, they state that their rifles will shoot 1 moa.

If I were looking for a small caliber varmint rifle then I would consider the H-S rifles as they are reasonably priced but for a larger caliber I would not even think about it.

To spend $2500 on a rifle that will shoot 1 moa is a poor investment in my opinion. For $2500 this is what you want in accuracy out of this size of a caliber:

Sorry, I was trying to post some target pics of the 338 Kahn but they won't come up on screen for some reason. Anyway, for this class of round my performance goals are sub 1/2 moa at 100 yards and 1/4 moa at 500 yards.

PLease do not spend this amount of money on a rifle that is only expected to shoot 1 moa by its builder. Give them a call and find out what their larger caliber rifles generally shoot. If they are just being conservative with the 1 moa level of accuracy and most rifles print 1/2 moa groups then thats another story but find this out first.

I do feel H-S is a quality company but do some homework before you order your new rifle.

Just my opinion,

Good Shooting!!

Kirby Allen(50)
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Kirby Allen(50)

Allen Precision Shooting
Home of the Allen Magnum, Allen Xpress and Allen Tactical Wildcats and the Painkiller Muzzle brakes.

Farther, Faster and Flatter then ever before.

Web Page: www.apsrifles.com

allenmagnum@gmail.com
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  #5  
Old 12-10-2004, 09:25 AM
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Re: 338 lapua v. 338-378 weatherby

I had that same question so I talked to the guys at HS Precision and they told me that they generally get 1/2 MOA or less out of their 338 tacticals at 100 yds. Do you recomend any one rifle builder for that amount of money?
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Old 12-10-2004, 12:58 PM
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Re: 338 lapua v. 338-378 weatherby

Not to step on anyone's toes but why does everyone think they have to spend 2000 + dollars to have a rifle shoot well? If you just want a factory rifle that will shoot under 1/2 get a Remington Sendero in a 338 Ultra Mag you can pick them up new for around 800 bucks. Now if you want to go the custom route get yourself a Rem 700 Action. I would just buy a used rifle in a 300 ultra or something. Then order yourself a match grade barrel and a good stock. Then send the action and barrel to a guy like Kirby who knows what he is doing and you will have your 1/2 inch or less rifle. The cost will be half of what HS wants for there rifle. Plus with the money you just saved you could get a really nice scope.
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Old 12-10-2004, 02:06 PM
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Re: 338 lapua v. 338-378 weatherby

I would tend to agree with Dakor here on this one. While it is nice to go hog wild on a full custom rifle, it may not be the best investment for alot of people.

First off, what do you want to do with this rifle?

YOu asked about 800 yard shooting and beyond, to be honest, if your only going to be shooting at 800 to 1000 yards, you will be just as well served with a big 7mm or 30 cal compared to the monster 338s.

That said, I am never one to discourage the use of very high powered rifles. Once youget used to it, 800 yards will be a chip shot with a quality rifle.

As an example, I took my little fast twist 6mm-284 out this morning before the winds came up and did some range practice at ranges from 500 to 1100 yards. Of the 30 rounds I sent down range, only 6 missed their mark and of those only 1 missed by more then a foot because of a wind shift I was not paying attention to.

This rifle is a factory stock, Win M70 Heavy Varminter which has been fitted with a 30" #7 contour fluted Lilja barrel with a 3 groove 1-8" twist. IT shoots the 107 gr Sierra Mks at 3450 fps into some pretty scary groups.

I got the rifle used at a gun show in its original 243 chambering for $480. I payed Lilja $400 for the 30" fluted barrel and the labor would have amounted to around $550 total which included action accurizing, fitting-chambering barrel, bedding and trigger job.

SO for all that your under $1500 for a total rifle ready to ship. To save even more you could go without the flutes which would cut another $115 off the total cost. For another $1100 you could damn near afford a 5.5-22 NXS nightforce to really top the rifle off well.

Like Dakor said, do not think your bound to a complete new rifle for the sake of extreme accuracy. THis is simply not the case by any shape or form.

Personally, if this is going to be an extreme range rifle chambered in one of these rounds, I would recommend a Rem 700 converted to single shot along with modifying the bolt stop to allow a longer bolt throat to spit out the long live rounds of these monsters loaded with true long range bullets.

At ranges past 800 yards, a repeater is really not needed. Havign a supply of ammo right off your trigger hand will allow second shots just as quickly as a repeating rifle but with the advatages of the stiffer action and better bedding area if you choose a conventionally bedded design.

If you want to go to the extreme, a Barrel Bedding V-Block rifle is the tops in extreme range performance but they do cost more depending on options. My Extreme Range Rifles will run in the $3200 to $3500 range while a smaller V-Block rifle like the 22-6mm AI I just sent out would run in the $2200 to $2400 range again depending on options.

I am not saying you should use me because there are alot of quality smiths around the country, make some phone calls to different smiths and find out what they are charging and what level of accuracy performance they demand in their rifles. Often rifles out of smaller shops are even better quality and at a much lower price.

Just something to think about before you jump in!

Good Shooting!!

Kirby Allen(50)
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Kirby Allen(50)

Allen Precision Shooting
Home of the Allen Magnum, Allen Xpress and Allen Tactical Wildcats and the Painkiller Muzzle brakes.

Farther, Faster and Flatter then ever before.

Web Page: www.apsrifles.com

allenmagnum@gmail.com
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