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1000 Yard Gun - .260 vs 6.5 Creedmoor

 
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  #29  
Old 11-03-2012, 07:46 AM
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Re: 1000 Yard Gun - .260 vs 6.5 Creedmoor

On the bear thought, is a 41 magnum enough back up for a bear? I bought a Ruger, I think it's a Redhawk 41 magnum, is it enough. I have a smith and wesson 460 xvr magnum too, but it is too bulky with a 10 inch barrel for a back up.
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  #30  
Old 11-03-2012, 10:41 AM
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Re: 1000 Yard Gun - .260 vs 6.5 Creedmoor

Cold Finger, I visited your awesome state a couple of years ago, during the summer. Everything is big up there. A good friend of mine who lives in Achorage blessed my wife and I with the use of his truck, camping gear, and 460 S&W hiking stick. After talking to a dog sledder up on the Danali Highway, I'm not sure anything smaller than a 50 BMG is adequate. I guess common sense has to prevail, or you won't. Back to the thread though, the 6.5 seems to be an ideal projectile. It has the best BC and SD of any of the pills I've looked at, no matter what brass it's housed in. Thoughts?

Crusty Buck
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  #31  
Old 11-03-2012, 11:29 AM
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Re: 1000 Yard Gun - .260 vs 6.5 Creedmoor

crusty, et.al.

i helped develope a 41 mag slug and load about 30 years ago. up to that time there was NO ONE who survived a bear ATTACK in alaska who had used a 44, 41, etc as bear defense. plenty had killed big bears with pistols as a hunt, but not surviving a bear attack. we started with 300 gr slugs in the 44 with this knowledge and from the work done in Africa with guides there using 44 mags as back up to their clients 460s and 458s etc. there was virtually no info in america on this type of shooting. talking to SSI ind. owner and reading all of elmer keiths articles i could find, plus p.o ackley and more, i found 335 gr hard cast slugs with or w/o cast checks at 1400 fps and a 310-320 gr in a 41 mag at same velocity were bear STOPPERS.. they have to have a very BIG front. the meplat is the key plus hard casting for max penetration. the keith SWC is too small on the front. the long wide nose on LBT's bullets and his shorter WN is the biggest frontal area available on commercial bullets and works like a charm. i have some that are almost full wadcutters but they are hard to work with.
since 1985, there have been MANY reports of people surviving bear ATTACKS using a 44 or equivalent pistol. some have been 9-10 foot grizzlies and some have been at point blank range. i have several customers and friends who have shot big bears at very short ranges and they all report the same thing-they dropped as if their heads were lopped off. one dispatched a 9 foot black here in montana. he was with F&G. same report. all find total penetration on the bear-often finding the slug going 1 foot or more into the ground after penetrating the bear and almost all of the slugs could be reshot if reloaded as there is virtually no marks other than rifling on the slugs. hope this answers your question.
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  #32  
Old 11-03-2012, 11:29 AM
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Location: Copper Basin, Alaska
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Re: 1000 Yard Gun - .260 vs 6.5 Creedmoor

A 41 mag in better than nothing, way better. But it's a little small. . With 250 gr hard cast, ect. Flatnose. Bullets at 1200fps . Its about as good as it gets in the 41 . The 460 is a real bear pistol in the 5" barrel.
The best rifles to dump a bear start in 41 caliber and go up.
However the 375 will work well but it's Not a big gun! But it is a good one. The 375 Ruger Alaskan is a pretty dang good companion in Alaska.

I know this will probably be "uncool " but if I wanted more than standard velocity 6.5. I would go to the 264 win mag. But the truth is I just a beginner in this long range area. So my ideas aren't worth a lot beyond what I do. But I had a 264 and really liked it that's all.
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  #33  
Old 11-03-2012, 12:02 PM
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Re: 1000 Yard Gun - .260 vs 6.5 Creedmoor

I did not see Pistol packers post.
I've never seen a 41 bullet over 250 grains. I think there would be a twist issue with bullets over 260 gr or so. I have used the 44mag. On a smaller brn.bear. 320gr.Cast Performance LFN. Pushed by 20gr of 296 . It worked. I didn't get bit. But I killed the bear with my rifle. I was thankful that I had the gun on me and that it kept me from bleeding. But I was underwhelmed with the killing performance. .

I don't want to get jammed up with the moderator so maybe we should continue this in its own thread somewhere. .
It's kind of the total opposite of a long range standard velocity rifle round.
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  #34  
Old 11-03-2012, 01:40 PM
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Re: 1000 Yard Gun - .260 vs 6.5 Creedmoor

Cold Trigger Finger,

Agreed, let's concentrate on on rifles, but tell me this; what was the longest shot you have made in Alaska? What were you hunting, using for a long arm, and the conditions under which the shot was made? Have you ever used the 6.5 on Brown Bear?

Pistol Packer, Your research has spurred my curriosity. It there another forum to discuss this on? I'm new to blogging.

Crusty Buck
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  #35  
Old 11-03-2012, 03:27 PM
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Re: 1000 Yard Gun - .260 vs 6.5 Creedmoor

My single longest shot was up hill at a Sitka Blacktail forked horn buck. Rifle was a Montana Rifle Co. S.S. in 375 H+H shooting Federal High Energy 300 gr Bear Claws that chronographed 2700fps from that rifle. 23"barrel. Scope was a fixed Leupold .
Distance was close to 1500 feet it was in a freshly logged clearcut in S.E.Ak.
I called the shot at behind the T in the scapula and under the spine .. I was about 5" off my intended impact point. The bullet struck in front of the T and about 3" down from where I planned. Took the arteries off the top of the heart. Bullet hole was still in the scapula. .

I put that rifle together myself and had run about 400 rounds thru it that fall.
I knew I could make the shot. I called it and made the shot.


Any 6.5 ain't a bear gun. Bear guns start at the 411 KDF and go up. But I believe that world class dangerous game should be hunted up close and personal.
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