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Long Range Scopes and Other Optics Nightforce Optics

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I am so confused

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  #8  
Unread 07-02-2002, 10:23 AM
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Join Date: May 2001
Location: Sask. Canada
Posts: 2,410
Re: I am so confused

Steve,
I did not do a very good job of explaining what I meant. I understand what you are saying about the screw pitch description - thanks. I admit to being completely mechanically challenged - work on the adage - righty tighty, lefty loosie... when it comes to screws and bolts.

Here is what I have found - I will use two of my scopes as an example - both 30mm tubes.
My Burris Black Diamond 3x-12x has 1/4 minute adjustments and it has almost 100 moa. All Black Diamond scopes with 1/4 minute adjustments have that same figure. My Burris Black Diamond 8-32 has 1/8 minute and it has 39 minutes, the 6-24 has 52 minutes. Same appearing turrets, I get less total adjustment movement with the 1/8 minute turret.

No doubt there are some 1/8 minute turrets that provide more adjustment, depending on their design but I have some Nikon 6.5-20's (1") that only have 38 moa and a Bushnell 4200 (1") 6-24 that only has 26 moa. Even with sloped bases these scopes can run out of adjustment pretty quick as they rarely zero at the bottom of their range. Plus you have to count more clicks, which is a pain.

I suggested not to get a 1/8th minute scope for LR because we recently had several guys shooting from 600 to 800 with some of the above scopes and they all ran out of adjustments before they got to 800.
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  •   #9  
    Unread 07-02-2002, 10:23 AM
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    Join Date: May 2001
    Location: Sask. Canada
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    Re: I am so confused

    Steve,
    I did not do a very good job of explaining what I meant. I understand what you are saying about the screw pitch description - thanks. I admit to being completely mechanically challenged - work on the adage - righty tighty, lefty loosie... when it comes to screws and bolts.

    Here is what I have found - I will use two of my scopes as an example - both 30mm tubes.
    My Burris Black Diamond 3x-12x has 1/4 minute adjustments and it has almost 100 moa. All Black Diamond scopes with 1/4 minute adjustments have that same figure. My Burris Black Diamond 8-32 has 1/8 minute and it has 39 minutes, the 6-24 has 52 minutes. Same appearing turrets, I get less total adjustment movement with the 1/8 minute turret.

    No doubt there are some 1/8 minute turrets that provide more adjustment, depending on their design but I have some Nikon 6.5-20's (1") that only have 38 moa and a Bushnell 4200 (1") 6-24 that only has 26 moa. Even with sloped bases these scopes can run out of adjustment pretty quick as they rarely zero at the bottom of their range. Plus you have to count more clicks, which is a pain.

    I suggested not to get a 1/8th minute scope for LR because we recently had several guys shooting from 600 to 800 with some of the above scopes and they all ran out of adjustments before they got to 800.
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      #10  
    Unread 07-03-2002, 01:13 PM
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    Join Date: May 2001
    Location: NC
    Posts: 352
    Re: I am so confused

    Ian M,
    OK I see what your driving at. I'm not an optics engineer and won't even come close to try to explain the design of scopes and optics, but here's my limited understanding.

    Notice in your (2) 1/8 click models you mentioned that they are much higher power than your 1/4 click models. Due to limitation of optics with focus distances, restricted size of a rifle scope and such, if you go up on magnification you loose some things. And one of them is adjustment range. This is independent of the click value though. If you look over any of the scope manufacturers reference charts you'll notice the higher the magnification the lower the total adjsutment range as a general rule. This included 1/4 or 1/8 click value. As you mentioned before different scope models and manufacturer due vary a little.

    A prime example to show the difference in magnification vs adjsutment range is the (2) Nightforce Benchrest models the 8-32 and 12-42 models both with 1/8MOA clicks almost exact same size lenses and outside dimensions. The 8-32 model has 50in of travel for elevation and windage. But the 12-42 only has 40in in both directions. Same sized 30MM tube, same diameter lenses, etc, etc. I beleive this is the difference your seeing in the amount of travel of 1/8 vs 1/4 click scopes. Almost all scope with 1/8 clicks are in the higher magnification range so it would be easy to come to that conclusion.

    Hope this explains it somewhat clear than mud. Or another way to look at it is if I take an existing Leopold scope that has x amount of travel and send it to Dick Thomas of Premier Reticles to change the click value to something finer, I'll get back a scope with the same amount of travel still in it, but the click value will change to a finer or courser value depending on what work is done because all else stayed the same within reason.

    Everyone have a great Independence Day!
    Steve
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      #11  
    Unread 07-03-2002, 09:47 PM
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    Join Date: Jun 2002
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    Re: I am so confused

    Thank you everyone for your input, here is what I bought.

    Leupold 51668 Vari-X III 4.5-14x50mm Long Range Tactical Matte 4.5-14x50 Mil Dot 1/4 MOA clicks, 80 MOA total.

    How'd I do?

    EZ
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      #12  
    Unread 07-03-2002, 10:09 PM
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    Join Date: May 2001
    Location: Pennsylvania
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    Re: I am so confused

    Just fine.
    __________________
    Darryl Cassel
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      #13  
    Unread 07-04-2002, 05:34 AM
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    Join Date: Dec 2001
    Location: Canyon Ferry, MT
    Posts: 324
    Re: I am so confused

    Nice choice EZ.

    MM
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      #14  
    Unread 07-04-2002, 10:43 AM
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    Join Date: May 2001
    Location: Sask. Canada
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    Re: I am so confused

    Dave King uses one of those particular scopes when he launches those "ineffective" Match Kings. I don't have one but used Dave's scope a while back and it is very fine.
    Good luck with your new rig.
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