Long Range Hunting Online Magazine


Go Back   Long Range Hunting Online Magazine > Hunting > Long Range Hunting & Shooting

Long Range Hunting & Shooting Nightforce Optics


Reply

Therohetical Hunting Scenario!

 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 12-02-2009, 12:53 PM
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Central Pennsylvania
Posts: 4,034
Therohetical Hunting Scenario!

Okay, so I'm bored and I should be in the woods right now shooting deer, BUT my car is at the garage and my ride is taking his dear to the butchers. So out of curiosity I start plunking around some ideas in my loosely gathered melon thinking about the perfect brush gun. But obviously it is not as simple as that.

This comes from spending a day in PA woods that is grossly thick with under brush and thinking to myself, Man if I hit a twig with this 7Mag, my 154 SP is going somewhere other than the intended target. Not to mention that I am grossly over powered for what will only be about a 10 ft to 75yrd shot max for a Whitetail. SOOOOO here is what I was thinking and basing it off of a wildcat or better projectile perspective based on an 08 casing.

Starting would be a mountain style stock, probably synthetic of some type. Pistol grip if I could work it out. Sights would be a military style AR peep in the rear and a fiber optic front sight for a bright sight to find. Or would one want a red dot reaction style sight knowing you should probably carry a hand full of batteries not knowing if you have time to flip it on? Barring dies, they can always be made.

Now for the fun part, CALIBER!!!! I have been waggling around in my brain the thought of the following:

a. 270-08
b. 8mm-08
c. 338-08
d. 358 Winchester
e. 375-08
f. 308 with 180 or 220 rnd. nose
or forget all the above even though it would be fun to play with and go with the old reliable 45-70? I should also add what bullet should be used with your selected caliber?

What say you? This should be fun.

Tank
__________________
Matthew 7:13-14
"Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. [14] But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.

If you find your self in a fair fight, your tactics suck!- Marine 1st Sergeant Jim Ryfinger

Friends don't let friends develop canonitis!-chucknbach

arguing over the internet is like the special Olympics....even if you win, you are still...special!

Last edited by liltank; 12-02-2009 at 01:43 PM. Reason: Title and content
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 12-02-2009, 02:00 PM
Silver Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Michigan
Posts: 449
Re: Therohetical Hunting Scenario!

Tank, my vote is for a slug gun. Probably a 12ga. I have an H&R Ultra Slugger that will knock a deer off his feet at 100 yards with Lightfield Hybrids.

Last edited by 3fingervic; 12-02-2009 at 02:03 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 12-02-2009, 02:06 PM
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: South of Canada and North of Wyoming
Posts: 5,954
Re: Therohetical Hunting Scenario!

Tank,

According to Mr Newton, an object in motion tends to stay in motion and it tends to want to maintain it's path. It takes some amount of force to change the momentum and direction of this object and the greater the momentum of the object the more difficult it will be to change the objects momentum and path. Monentum is directly proportional to velocity and mass. Meaning, that your 7mm RM will be a better brush gun than the -08 variants unless you can produce enough velocity on a given weight bullet to exceed the velocity-mass of the 154 SP. Then of course, stability of the bullet also plays a big factor.

The 154 with am MV of 3100 has a momentum of 68 lb ft/s. The 270-08 is definitely not a player. the 358 Win shooting a 225 bullet with an MV 2500 (on the upper end) has a momentum of 80 lb ft/s so it will resist deflection from brush a little better than the 7RM. Anything larger on the list than the 358 will probably do even better. Without knowing bullet weight and velocity, my guess would be the 338-08 will be close to the 7RM and the 8mm would be "iffy".

My uncle was/is the beat PA deer hunter I knew. He used a .308, which IMHO is probably the all around best cartridge for "average" PA deer hunting.

Hope you get out in the woods soon and get your buck

Mark
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 12-02-2009, 02:14 PM
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Montana
Posts: 1,355
Re: Therohetical Hunting Scenario!

I don't think there is any bullet/rifle combo that will maintain poa after impacting brush. Perhaps a hand grenade launcher will work. Other wise I would say a 30-30 with peep sight would work well. Must have no brush in the flight path though.

Steve
__________________
To hunt... or not to hunt...? What a stupid question.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 12-02-2009, 02:21 PM
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Central Pennsylvania
Posts: 4,034
Re: Therohetical Hunting Scenario!

Quote:
Originally Posted by MontanaRifleman View Post
Tank,

According to Mr Newton, an object in motion tends to stay in motion and it tends to want to maintain it's path. It takes some amount of force to change the momentum and direction of this object and the greater the momentum of the object the more difficult it will be to change the objects momentum and path. Monentum is directly proportional to velocity and mass. Meaning, that your 7mm RM will be a better brush gun than the -08 variants unless you can produce enough velocity on a given weight bullet to exceed the velocity-mass of the 154 SP. Then of course, stability of the bullet also plays a big factor.

The 154 with am MV of 3100 has a momentum of 68 lb ft/s. The 270-08 is definitely not a player. the 358 Win shooting a 225 bullet with an MV 2500 (on the upper end) has a momentum of 80 lb ft/s so it will resist deflection from brush a little better than the 7RM. Anything larger on the list than the 358 will probably do even better. Without knowing bullet weight and velocity, my guess would be the 338-08 will be close to the 7RM and the 8mm would be "iffy".

My uncle was/is the beat PA deer hunter I knew. He used a .308, which IMHO is probably the all around best cartridge for "average" PA deer hunting.

Hope you get out in the woods soon and get your buck

Mark

Very interesting. Thank you and keep them coming. Is the 338-08 the 338 Federal?

Tank
__________________
Matthew 7:13-14
"Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. [14] But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.

If you find your self in a fair fight, your tactics suck!- Marine 1st Sergeant Jim Ryfinger

Friends don't let friends develop canonitis!-chucknbach

arguing over the internet is like the special Olympics....even if you win, you are still...special!
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 12-02-2009, 03:32 PM
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: South of Canada and North of Wyoming
Posts: 5,954
Re: Therohetical Hunting Scenario!

Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by liltank View Post
....keep them coming.
OK

The 338-08 is the Feceral. I had thought it was off the .06 case case but after looking it up it's off the .08 case. And that being said, a 210 bullet out of a 338 Fed moving at 2600 fps will generate 78 lb ft/s of momentum, so a good choice.

I think probably the biggest factors in choosing a brush cartridge are bullet construction and stability. I would avoid HPs and poly tipped bullets and go with a protected SP like a Swift A-Frame. A hard cast 12 g slug might be a good choice at close range if it was well stabilized.

EDIT: Having said that the 308 is IMO the best all around rifle in PA for "average" deer hunting, I would choose 300 WSM and if I thought I was hunting brushy areas, I would probably go with a 200 gr A-Frame. At 2900 fps it would have a little more momentum than the 338 or 358. Now if we step up to a 338 WSM or 358 WSM, those would be some good brush busters....

Last edited by MontanaRifleman; 12-02-2009 at 03:44 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 12-02-2009, 03:36 PM
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: South of Canada and North of Wyoming
Posts: 5,954
Re: Therohetical Hunting Scenario!

Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by RockyMtnMT View Post
I don't think there is any bullet/rifle combo that will maintain poa after impacting brush. Perhaps a hand grenade launcher will work. Other wise I would say a 30-30 with peep sight would work well. Must have no brush in the flight path though.

Steve
I guess it all depends on how thick the brush is, how close the target is and how big the kill zone is. I have never been one to shoot through brush but might consider it if the situation was right.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes


Similar Threads for: Therohetical Hunting Scenario!
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Read 30 coyote hunting articles - newly organized "coyote hunting" category page Len Backus Coyote Hunting - From 10 Yards to over 1,000 Yards 1 04-20-2011 11:46 AM
Describe a normal call scenario.... Captn C Coyote Hunting - From 10 Yards to over 1,000 Yards 7 01-23-2008 01:43 PM
A Better 4x4 Hunting Vehicle. I need a hunting partner! 4mesh063 The Basics, Starting Out 7 11-10-2003 07:58 AM

Current Poll
Do you archery hunt for elk?
YES - 32.82%
85 Votes
NO - 49.42%
128 Votes
Not yet, but I plan to. - 17.76%
46 Votes
Total Votes: 259
You may not vote on this poll.

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:49 PM.


Powered by vBulletin ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Management Powered by vBadvanced CMPS
All content ©2010-2014 Long Range Hunting, LLC