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Some guidance so I don't blow myself up...

 
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  #15  
Old 11-03-2009, 11:16 AM
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Re: Some guidance so I don't blow myself up...

If you know your conditions you can stock pile all you want. Like I said, if you write down your information when shooting and doing load development then you will see a pattern of how to load for any powder at any given condition. If you can do some load development for temperatures in the 80's write it down what you used and how many grains. Write down temp, load, primer, humidity, velocity and group size.

Then if you get a chance to shoot at single digit temps, attempt shooting your loads and see what it does. It may be fine and you will not have to adjust much, maybe change your zero for slower velocity. Chances are though, the load you put together for 85 degrees will not work quite as well at 10 degrees. Ideally you want to know exactly how it is going to perform for its given conditions. That is why US snipers write down every shot including temp, humidity, wind direction, wind speed, and elevation. Elevation is also a very important factor. The higher you go up the less elevation in your scope you will need to hit your intended target. Thinner air results in less drag. The more you can shoot and develop for your conditions the more effective you will be as a marksmen.

So keeping track of all these conditions will help to develop good loads. As far as the age of a load, as long as there is no corrosion on the casings and lead you can shoot away. You have to be careful with other people loads in your rifle. What worked in their rifle may not work in yours. Storage and care of handling said loads determines their accuracy and ability to fire. If they draw in humidity into the powder then the loads will not be near as potent as a fresh load. The inaccuracy your friend experienced may have been due to poor rifle maintenance and loads developed for a rifle that he did not use. Each rifle is different and will shoot hand loads differently. I generally will not shoot another persons hand loads for safety. If I know the person and they developed the load for my rifle then I don't have a problem or the load is a load that I know is safe for my rifle. There are guys using ammo from the Korean War, Vietnam and WWII because it was surplus from the wars and fit their rifles. It is all in care of handling.

Tank
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Matthew 7:13-14
"Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. [14] But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.

If you find your self in a fair fight, your tactics suck!- Marine 1st Sergeant Jim Ryfinger

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Last edited by liltank; 11-03-2009 at 11:26 AM. Reason: grammar
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  #16  
Old 11-03-2009, 11:20 AM
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Re: Some guidance so I don't blow myself up...

Quote:
Originally Posted by MontanaRifleman View Post
ronedog,

Tank summed it up pretty well. I'll add that the two biggest things in LR shooting besides the obvious accuracy/consistancy, are BC and velocity. That's what gets you farther down range with more enrgy/momentum and bucks wind. But like Tank mentioned, sometimes there are tradeoffs. His report on RL17's temp sensitivity has me a little concerned. We get some extreme swings in temps here in MT which would have an effect on the bullet's performance at longer ranges. RL 22 and 25 usually produce good velocities but they are very temp sensitive. The Hodgdon Etreme powders are less temp sensitive.

If you're looking for 1K shooting, you should be striving for sub .5 MOA accuracy. I am finding that my MOA accuracy gets slightly better at 300 and 400 yds than 100yds. You should be testing your accuracy at 300 yds and farther because bullets sometimes take a little while to "go to sleep" which referes to their pitch and yaw. You should be looking for 1" - 1 1/2" groups @ 300 yds and 1 1/2" - 2" groups @ 400 yds.

Mark

RL15 is pretty temperature finicky too. I think the Alliant powders are inherently temperature sensitive. I have noticed with both the 15 and 17 that more than 20 degrees will result in needing a load change.
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Matthew 7:13-14
"Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. [14] But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.

If you find your self in a fair fight, your tactics suck!- Marine 1st Sergeant Jim Ryfinger

Friends don't let friends develop canonitis!-chucknbach

arguing over the internet is like the special Olympics....even if you win, you are still...special!
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  #17  
Old 11-03-2009, 11:27 AM
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Re: Some guidance so I don't blow myself up...

Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by liltank View Post
RL15 is pretty temperature finicky too. I think the Alliant powders are inherently temperature sensitive. I have noticed with both the 15 and 17 that more than 20 degrees will result in needing a load change.
They "advertise" 17 to be stable 20 degrees wont cut it for me.
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  #18  
Old 11-03-2009, 11:51 AM
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Re: Some guidance so I don't blow myself up...

you don't say where you are hunting deer and elk. also i don't think he will know the speed of his load or es because no chrono. re-19 and wlrm primer and a 168 bal silver tip for the 300 wsm. lapua brass and 165 to 175 for the 30-06. my 30-06 like 50.5 of varget( which is not temp sensitive) and 165 or 168. 210m or br-2 primer. i was unable to get the accuracy with i-4350 in my gun/s.
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  #19  
Old 11-03-2009, 12:18 PM
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Re: Some guidance so I don't blow myself up...

Like MR stated, Hodgdon powders and I believe IMR powders are a little more stable powders for temperature. I have experienced some temp issues with H1000 and ball powders such as Winchester powders and I know for a fact that old reliable H380 is temp sensitive. I am currently using H335 for my .308 which seems to be holding pretty good so far. Man you should see the fireball that comes out of my 18" barrel with H335. Hope my son doesn't shoot anything in low light.

Tank
__________________
Matthew 7:13-14
"Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. [14] But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.

If you find your self in a fair fight, your tactics suck!- Marine 1st Sergeant Jim Ryfinger

Friends don't let friends develop canonitis!-chucknbach

arguing over the internet is like the special Olympics....even if you win, you are still...special!
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  #20  
Old 11-03-2009, 12:40 PM
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Join Date: May 2008
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Re: Some guidance so I don't blow myself up...

Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by roninflag View Post
i don't think he will know the speed of his load or es because no chrono.
Which brings up another point. I don't totally trust my chrono. I got a second one (Chrony Alpha) and put it back to back with my old Prochrony and reading varried anywhere from 5-50 fps. The Prochrony always read higher. I have also seen both chrony's give different ranges as lighting changes, especially in shadows. Granted, these aren't the best chrony's on the market but I think the best way guage consistancy is with shooting and ladder testing or the verticle offsets of groups at different ranges.
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  #21  
Old 11-03-2009, 01:54 PM
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Re: Some guidance so I don't blow myself up...

Yeah we have two different chrony's that read predictably different. Mine reads on avg. 30fps slower than my cousins. His reads faster and I think is more likely the more accurate. Setting my tables to my readings always shoot high telling me that it is not reading fast enough. Mine up until this last trip to the range read more consistently. This last time out, my cousins read consistently with higher speeds and provided much better data. We figured out that his lapua is maxed out with speed at 92.2 grns of H1000 but can shoot a lower ES with 93.2 but the speed avg is the same. He gets 11fps spread with the lighter load and only a 6fps spread with the heavier. I found mine to be all over the place with 100fps spread and my speeds dropped way off. That was with virgin brass though.

Tank
__________________
Matthew 7:13-14
"Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. [14] But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.

If you find your self in a fair fight, your tactics suck!- Marine 1st Sergeant Jim Ryfinger

Friends don't let friends develop canonitis!-chucknbach

arguing over the internet is like the special Olympics....even if you win, you are still...special!
Reply With Quote
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