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New found knowledge... Tested!

 
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  #1  
Old 04-27-2010, 05:43 PM
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Location: Central Pennsylvania
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New found knowledge... Tested!

Well I put into practice some new knowledge today. I was use to the old ways of running bullets close to the lands and neck sizing only. As you all know, I went to the shoot in Williamsport this past weekend. While I was there, I asked a lot of information and information was offered without prompting. I just happen to be around when one guy was talking about Berger bullets. He used a .309 neck sizing bushing and showed another guy the lack of quality control at Berger. He slid one bullet through and another bullet from the same batch and it did not pass through. When asked if he has seen a decline in quality he answered yes. He said the bullets from this year are running .030" longer than last year.

Well this conversation lead into seating depth. The one guy said that he set his bullets .080" to .100" deep with VLD's. This goes against everything I have ever read or learned from other shooters. When I questioned this he said, "Guys that shoot short distance will seat to the lands or stuff them in." He said that most guys that shoot long distance target always seat their bullets deep.

Talking to another individual I asked about his loading. I asked why I was getting pressure sign after firing from virgin brass that showed no signs of anything wrong? I told him that I only neck size and that I load to the lands. He said that he always FL sizes his brass, and for the first firing on virgin brass he will load to the lands, but after that he always seats deep also. He said that FL sizing always keeps things equal for him across the board. He said he always bumps the shoulders too. He uses a 300 Win Mag.

So with this new found knowledge I tried a couple of suggestions. 1. I put all my loaded rounds through the body sizing die and bumped the shoulders. Then I seated the bullets at .050", .075", and .100" from the lands. Well the .050" put 2 shots within an 1" of each other and the 3rd dropped about 3.5" low. The second group of .075" produced about 3" and the shots were more concentric. The third proved to be the money length. .100" produced a 1.550"
Reduced 77%
640 x 480 (26.52K)
giving me .493 MOA at 300yrds. All loads were tested at this distance. It was 50 degrees with 6 to 8 mph winds from my 7 o'clock. It was rather exciting and I am going to stop there and not touch anything. Thought I would share. I was also shooting prone off of a bi-pod and rear bag.

Tank
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  #2  
Old 04-27-2010, 07:34 PM
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Re: New found knowledge... Tested!

Nice shootin' Tank.
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  #3  
Old 04-27-2010, 08:33 PM
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Re: New found knowledge... Tested!

K.I.S.S. (keep it simple stupid) Works every time.

Steve
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  #4  
Old 04-27-2010, 09:21 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Grantsville Utah
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Re: New found knowledge... Tested!

Quote:
Originally Posted by liltank View Post
Well I put into practice some new knowledge today. I was use to the old ways of running bullets close to the lands and neck sizing only. As you all know, I went to the shoot in Williamsport this past weekend. While I was there, I asked a lot of information and information was offered without prompting. I just happen to be around when one guy was talking about Berger bullets. He used a .309 neck sizing bushing and showed another guy the lack of quality control at Berger. He slid one bullet through and another bullet from the same batch and it did not pass through. When asked if he has seen a decline in quality he answered yes. He said the bullets from this year are running .030" longer than last year.

Well this conversation lead into seating depth. The one guy said that he set his bullets .080" to .100" deep with VLD's. This goes against everything I have ever read or learned from other shooters. When I questioned this he said, "Guys that shoot short distance will seat to the lands or stuff them in." He said that most guys that shoot long distance target always seat their bullets deep.

Talking to another individual I asked about his loading. I asked why I was getting pressure sign after firing from virgin brass that showed no signs of anything wrong? I told him that I only neck size and that I load to the lands. He said that he always FL sizes his brass, and for the first firing on virgin brass he will load to the lands, but after that he always seats deep also. He said that FL sizing always keeps things equal for him across the board. He said he always bumps the shoulders too. He uses a 300 Win Mag.

So with this new found knowledge I tried a couple of suggestions. 1. I put all my loaded rounds through the body sizing die and bumped the shoulders. Then I seated the bullets at .050", .075", and .100" from the lands. Well the .050" put 2 shots within an 1" of each other and the 3rd dropped about 3.5" low. The second group of .075" produced about 3" and the shots were more concentric. The third proved to be the money length. .100" produced a 1.550"
Reduced 77%
640 x 480 (26.52K)
giving me .493 MOA at 300yrds. All loads were tested at this distance. It was 50 degrees with 6 to 8 mph winds from my 7 o'clock. It was rather exciting and I am going to stop there and not touch anything. Thought I would share. I was also shooting prone off of a bi-pod and rear bag.

Tank
Hi Tank! That is really interesting! Did he give any reason as to why the long range guys seat way off of the lands? I can only assume that it has to do with the bullet stabilizing after distance but then why would it shoot better at close range seated out? Seems contradictory and kind of a mystery? On the other hand, sounds like it worked for you.....Rich
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  #5  
Old 04-27-2010, 11:10 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Northeast MS
Posts: 364
Re: New found knowledge... Tested!

Great shooting! I have always tested various seating depths with different rifles and several times have been surprised at what I have found.
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  #6  
Old 04-27-2010, 11:45 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: sebastopol, ca.
Posts: 418
Re: New found knowledge... Tested!

Interesting information Tank.
I was talking to a guy at our local range one day and he is a long range competition shooter. He has held several world records at the 600 and 1000 yard ranges, we talked about seating depths and his observations.
His techniques are the same as what you found. He told me some of the guys are seating bullets at .125" off the lands. These guys are breaking world records every few months so it must work.
I am working up loads for my 7 WSM and plan on trying the deeper seating approach during my testing.
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  #7  
Old 04-28-2010, 12:41 AM
GNERGY
 
Posts: n/a
Re: New found knowledge... Tested!

Tank, now you have me wondering cause so far I can't get the 250 NAB to shoot in my 338 ultra mag. I have loaded .005 .010 .015 .020 off the lands and now I have some loaded touching the lands to go shoot tomorrow and they say 25 to 40 MPH winds.
I know from the factory they come with a freebore so maybe I should seat some deeper if the ones at the lands don't work.
If the Noslers don't group I am going to switch to Barnes.
Keep us informed on your progress
Tarey

Last edited by GNERGY; 04-28-2010 at 12:50 AM.
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