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Longrange PD cartridge - Part II

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Unread 11-06-2003, 07:39 PM
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Join Date: May 2001
Location: Urich, MO
Posts: 838
Re: Longrange PD cartridge - Part II

All the other guys are right on the money. Not saying you're caliber is bad but in this situation the 243 is better.
Call Kevin Thomas at Sierra and ask him about the computer data. He'll tell you that beyond 300 it's pretty much an educated guess. Real world is not accurately portrayed in the ballistics programs. The wind does not blow at 9 oclock position at 10 mph from muzzle to the 1000 target. The guys on this site shoot and shoot often, me included, at 1,000 or beyond. They have real world experience. Now that's not saying you can't do it with the 22-243 you can as a 1000 record was held for awhile by a 220 Swift and I have seen a 6" 1000 yrd group shot by a 17 Rem.
Fact is the 243 will be more consistant than the Cheetah(basically what you have), 17, Swift etc. But the 300 WSM, RUM or 338 Lapua will outperform the 243.
Chris Matthews
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Unread 11-06-2003, 09:24 PM
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Join Date: May 2001
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 1,757
Re: Longrange PD cartridge - Part II


As per the Oehler Ballistics program which I feel is one of the best and closest to actual BCs.

Sierra MK 107 Gr 6mm----.555BC

Sierra 80 Gr MK 224 bullet---.420

These BCs fall in line with what I have found to be true in actual fire situations using both bullets in my 22/284, 6/284 and my 243 with a 30" barrels and 8 twists.

I to am fond of my 22/284 but the fact remains, the 6/284 and the 243 at extended range is much more consistant and produces less throat eroasion then the 224 bullet does at high velocity, especially 3500, to 3600 Fps.
Many high velocity 22s are shot out in 600 rounds or less. I know of one that was gone at 400 rounds.

As mentioned, if the 80 gr 224 was so good, it would be used and winning 1000 yard matches consistanly but, it don't.
That's why I agreed with another poster that the 243 would be a good choice for his P-Dog shooting out to 1000 yards, plus a bit.

If I'm going to shoot 500 rounds per day (or more) at 800 to 1000 yards, I'll take the 243 with a 30" barrel and 8 twist shooting the 105 or 107 gr bullets.

DC [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]
Darryl Cassel
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Unread 11-07-2003, 12:26 AM
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Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Washington State
Posts: 120
Re: Longrange PD cartridge - Part II


I have a .260 that I have used for several years with the 100 grain Sierra Varmint at about 3270 fps. This is a dandy round when a little wind comes up in South Dakota (Try 18mph for a start.) My experience tells me that this combination runs out of gas at about 700 yards.

I am further experimenting with the 7mm WSM.

That thing will put out a Burger 180 VLD (BC=.698) at about 2850 fps. My ballistics calculator tells me that I can get to 1000 yards with a come up of about 25 moa. (Sierra is about to launch a 175 SMK for this caliber as well.)

The rifle will also extrude a 100gr Sierra Varmint HP at a little over 3500, but I'm told a steady diet of these is not advisable. I will probably take 20 or so to the next hunt in case things need to be livened up a little. [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]


[ 11-06-2003: Message edited by: DMCI ]
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Unread 11-09-2003, 10:48 AM
MAX MAX is offline
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Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 263
Re: Longrange PD cartridge - Part II

Perhaps of small import to this discusson, but I'd think the .22 will require a faster twist and this compounds Yaw of Repose issues. Between that and short barrel life for the CHeetah I'd go with the .243 and never look back. Truth is I'd probably opt for a 6.5 or larger still. LONG range requires precision and it's easier to find with larger bores. Faster ain't always bester. You asked for advice and got some good stuff from Darryl.

Of course if you just really want a hotshot .22 I'd understand that without jumping thru all the rationalization part. There is always the Barnes QT approach if you want to make your own 125 gr. .224 bullets and use a 5" twist. I'm sure the BC is high, even if the velocity is mild... [img]images/icons/wink.gif[/img] Mebbe with a Rigby case though.... [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

Best of luck with your choice. I've felt your pain.
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Unread 11-10-2003, 01:21 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Central PA
Posts: 1,307
Re: Longrange PD cartridge - Part II

it would be a great PD gun--but the barrel may only last one day on the town if you arent careful--definately want to pick your shots with that one.
i'l stick withthe 223 for high volume PD shooting--and 243ack and above for long PD's

Check it Out!!--> Shoot the Smack The Smiley Match...and help AmericanSnipers.org
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Unread 11-11-2003, 12:39 AM
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Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 18
Re: Longrange PD cartridge - Part II

The 243 AI will push a 107 gr much farter than 3100 f/s I know they will go to 3400 f/s. My 6 BR is running 107's at 2900f/s. Also look at the 105 Berger bc .562 or the 95 berger bc .524 and can be pushed faster than the 105's. The 1000 yds BR shooter like to run the big bullets at 3100 to 3150 f/s for better accuracy but your 243AI & 6mm AI will run them much faster. but the 22-243 would make a good PD gun.
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Unread 11-11-2003, 07:33 AM
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Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Ca
Posts: 101
Re: Longrange PD cartridge - Part II

To answer Varmint Hunters questions yes two bullets with the same bc fired at the same speed reach the target at the same time(same flight time),have the same amount of drop and or affected by the wind the same amount.The only difference is the retained energy at the target.The 22/243 isn't as inherently accurate as a 6br and small things such as fouling disrupt the smaller bullet to a larger degree.Due to the high bc of some bullets the 22 was tried at 1000 yards but bc alone doesn't mean anything without accuracy and that is why they aren't used .Remember Lost River sells .930 bc 30 cal 220 gr J40 bullets which are much better BC wise than anything mentioned even 300 gr Sierra 338 cal but nobody shoots them because they simply don't shoot accurately enough for a competition rig.Another case would be Sierras 155 gr 6.5mm with its higher bc number than the 142's if it aint accurate forget it.
I have a 6/284 that shoots the 107's to a little over 3400 fps but best accuracy is at 3200 fps so it sits in the closet.My 6-06 shoots the 107's very accurately at 3433 fps with 57 grains of H1000 a Fed 210M primer and Lapua 30-06 brass necked down so it gets used all the time.When the barrels wear out the tide may change and the 6/284 may shoot better at the upper velocity range and therefore get used more often.The Sierra Match bullets tend to be easier to keep tuned and easier to tune initially in my opinion so they get the nod when it comes to extended sessions of Prairie Doggin.Run a ballistic program on the 6mm 107 at 3433 fps coupled with great accuracy and you have a winning combination.
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