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Gun build - Scope help PLEASE

 
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  #8  
Old 03-30-2011, 04:59 AM
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Re: Gun build - Scope help PLEASE

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Originally Posted by teampete View Post
Well I may have to limit my elk hunt to 800 yards then??? The only calibers I can get are 7mm or 300 win mag. Deer and other az game can be out to 1000 yards I guess. So is there really much difference in the 300 vs 7mm then for probable distance to kill an elk. I do plan on using berger vlds if that helps any
Beyond 600yds on Elk Sized game between the two I'd go with the .300 win mag?

Why are you limited to only those two calibers? Are you on a tight budget buying a factory stock rifle or having one built?

Yes there's a considerable difference in energy and BC between the 7mm and 7.62 bullets fired by the 7mm Rem Mag and 300 win mag.

Pull up any ballistics chart and compare the performance of the two cartriges.

Then got to Berger and Hornady's sites and look at the difference in BC's between the 162-180gr 7mm's and 7.62 168-210gr bullets.

http://www.hornady.com/store/searcha...=373&x=12&y=16

http://www.bergerbullets.com/Product...20Bullets.html

EDTA:

Found this old article by Chuck Hawks that might be of some help to you.

http://www.chuckhawks.com/game_range_caliber.htm
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Last edited by WildRose; 03-30-2011 at 05:09 AM.
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  #9  
Old 03-30-2011, 08:06 AM
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Re: Gun build - Scope help PLEASE

Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by teampete View Post
Well I may have to limit my elk hunt to 800 yards then??? The only calibers I can get are 7mm or 300 win mag. Deer and other az game can be out to 1000 yards I guess. So is there really much difference in the 300 vs 7mm then for probable distance to kill an elk. I do plan on using berger vlds if that helps any
Congrats on your draw. If I had the choice between a 7RM and 300 WM for elk hunting I would pick the 300. The 300 will plain and simple be able to do more damage with a larger cal bullet. If you want to be hunting at extended ranges you should be handloading which should give you more flexibility in choosing powder and bullet for optimal LR shooting. You can't really just set an arbitrary distance limitation like 600 or 800, etc. The performance of your load will determine it's effective range and I use the minimum expanding velocity for the bullet to determine that. For elk, I would pad that velocity a little.

For a scope, you might look at the Vortex PST's.

Good hunting,

-Mark
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  #10  
Old 03-30-2011, 08:40 AM
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Re: Gun build - Scope help PLEASE

Thanks for all the help guys. I changed the calliber to 300 win mag. My funds are limited. I am only 22 years old and starting my long range career. I am getting the savage lrh for less than 600 dollars out the door. I have researched a lot and don't see any way I can get a better gun for that price.
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  #11  
Old 03-30-2011, 08:52 AM
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Re: Gun build - Scope help PLEASE

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Originally Posted by teampete View Post
Thanks for all the help guys. I changed the calliber to 300 win mag. My funds are limited. I am only 22 years old and starting my long range career. I am getting the savage lrh for less than 600 dollars out the door. I have researched a lot and don't see any way I can get a better gun for that price.
Makes perfect sense. My taste in personal weapons has always outstripped my budget as well.

Figure out what the best glass you can afford is, and then spend another 100-200.00 on it.

Get the weapon to the best gun smith you can find and get it pillar bedded and free floated.

Then take whatever spare change you can scratch up and get out and shoot the damned thing as much as you can at varying ranges between 500 and 1000yds noting the variables in wind and temp and what you have to do to correct.

No one becomes even a competent long range shooter without a hell of a lot of practice and to become proficient can take years of practice with good instruction, and lots of study.

Best of luck.
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  #12  
Old 03-30-2011, 11:57 AM
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Re: Gun build - Scope help PLEASE

I respectfully disagree. The 7mm is more than ample on elk out to 1000 yds. I personally think anything over 7mm is overkill on any animal you'll hunt in the lower 48. Never been a fan of the ultra mags for this very reason. Why deal with the recoil when it's not necessary. My idea of the perfect rifle is one that will maintain enough energy at a 1000 yds to kill up to elk size game, with the least amount of recoil. The 7mm is that kind of cartridge. For example, compare the ballistics of a 180 gr nosler accubond out of 300 wm vs a 180 berger vld out of a 7mm mag both with a muzzle velocity of 3000 fps. At a 1000 yds the 180 7mm still has a MV of 1725 fps whereas the 180 300 wm has a mv of 1431.7 fps. The 300 will drop 275 inches at a 1000 yds whereas the 7mm will only drop 234 inches. Heres the kicker: The 7mm 180 has 1189 lbs of energy at 1000 yds whereas the 300 wm 180 has only 819 lbs at 1000 yds. Don't get me wrong the 300 wm is a great cartridge and my current long range record kill is with a 180 nosler AB out of a 300, but the 7mm is the clear winner at a 1000 yds.

Last edited by cabinfever; 03-30-2011 at 12:31 PM.
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  #13  
Old 03-30-2011, 12:17 PM
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Re: Gun build - Scope help PLEASE

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Originally Posted by cabinfever View Post
I respectfully disagree. The 7mm is more than ample on elk out to 1000 yds. I personally think anything over 7mm is overkill on any animal you'll hunt in the lower 48. Never been a fan of the ultra mags for this very reason. Why deal with the recoil when it's not necessary. My idea of the perfect rifle is one that will maintain enough energy at a 1000 yds to kill up to elk size game, with the least amount of recoil. The 7mm is that kind of cartridge.
And I've kille 500lbs hogs with a .204 Ruger but I'm not going to recommend it to a rookie for a hog gun.

I know any number of people including myself that have killed 600-1000lbs game at 600-1000yds with the 7mm mag and 7STW.

But shot placement becomes even more critical when energy is minimal and very few people are capable of doing so precisely at those ranges.

As hunters, particularly when we are bringing new people along in the sport I just feel obligated to recommend the "best" weapon and round for a one shot kill every time, not just when an expert marksman is behind a custom long range weapon.

Recoil is simply not a significant factor with most of the mag's and ultra magnums in the era of modern muzzle brakes either. Not for anyone over 140lbs anyhow.
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  #14  
Old 03-30-2011, 12:41 PM
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Re: Gun build - Scope help PLEASE

so explain to this young guy why the 7mm mag has more energy at a 1000 yds than the 300 wm, yet you are recommending the 300 wm. (see edited post above). And since the 300 wm drops over 3 feet more than the 7mm at a 1000 yds, wouldn't you agree that there is a lot more room for error which could result in a miss, or worse....wounding a critter. See above post for ballistic comparsions. i agree that the 300 wm in not a bad choice, but it is certainly not the best.
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