Long Range Hunting Online Magazine


Go Back   Long Range Hunting Online Magazine > Hunting > Long Range Hunting & Shooting

Long Range Hunting & Shooting Nightforce Optics


View Poll Results: How do y'all prepare your ammo for long range hunting?
Full lenght resize 129 48.86%
Neck size only with occasional shoulder bump 133 50.38%
Factory loads only 2 0.76%
Voters: 264. This poll is closed

Reply

Full length resize or neck size only for y'all long range hunters?

 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #71  
Old 09-25-2013, 04:40 PM
Silver Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 141
Re: Full length resize or neck size only for y'all long range hunters?

I don't think we are in disagreement too much. We both agree that trial and error is a must with each individual rifle to match your case with your chamber. But I still do not understand why you FL size and the neck size afterwards.
Then FL sizing completes negates any advantage you gain with neck sizing. All you do is create a case that matches your die makers specs, which may not match your chamber specs. No die maker, regardless of brand, quality, or specialty, makes a die that creates a case that fits each and every rifle. The only way to do that is fireform, neck size, and reload. End of story, unless your bolt will not close comfortably. I do not know if Sako still does this, but 40 years ago, they used a chamber reamer three times. They cut a chamber, sharpened the reamer, cut another chamber, sharpened the reamer, and cut a third chamber and then threw the reamer away. Since the reamer had been sharpened twice, all three chambers had different specs. I have three 300 Win mags. A Remington Sendero, a Tikka, and an Encore. A fireformed case from the Sendero will not chamber in either of the other rifles. Cases FL sized will. Therefore, using a FL sized case in my Sendero is like having a marble rolling around in a pop bottle hoping to find its way out of the neck. What makes matters worse is that a FL sized case head spaces on the belt. A fireformed case headspaces on the belt AND the shoulder, and assuming that whatever rifle you are working with was reamed properly so the center line of the case and bullet is on the same plane as the center line of the barrel, the cartridge is locked in for its best possible accuracy. A good rule of thumb for reloading any case is to make as few changes to a fired case as is possible and still come up with a reloaded case that chamber well in the gun. Why FL size when neck sizing creates an absolute minimum of stress on the case, therefore making the case live longer, fit the rifle better, and be more accurate? This is a whole different topic, but another habit a lot of shooters I see at the range have is primer pocket reaming. They ream the primer pocket before each reloading and then wonder why their brass only lasts three or four loads before primers start falling out and they have an action full of powder. The new chemical brass cleaners are a Godsend for us reloaders because they completely clean primer pockets making a reamer an antique. If there was ever a process that the KISS rule applied to, it is cartridge reloading. But, as I have said many times on the forum, if it works for you, keep doing it.
Reply With Quote
  #72  
Old 09-25-2013, 04:59 PM
Bronze Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: HOLLYWOOD
Posts: 82
Re: Full length resize or neck size only for y'all long range hunters?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Old teacher View Post
I don't think we are in disagreement too much. We both agree that trial and error is a must with each individual rifle to match your case with your chamber. But I still do not understand why you FL size and the neck size afterwards.
Then FL sizing completes negates any advantage you gain with neck sizing. All you do is create a case that matches your die makers specs, which may not match your chamber specs. No die maker, regardless of brand, quality, or specialty, makes a die that creates a case that fits each and every rifle. The only way to do that is fireform, neck size, and reload. End of story, unless your bolt will not close comfortably. I do not know if Sako still does this, but 40 years ago, they used a chamber reamer three times. They cut a chamber, sharpened the reamer, cut another chamber, sharpened the reamer, and cut a third chamber and then threw the reamer away. Since the reamer had been sharpened twice, all three chambers had different specs. I have three 300 Win mags. A Remington Sendero, a Tikka, and an Encore. A fireformed case from the Sendero will not chamber in either of the other rifles. Cases FL sized will. Therefore, using a FL sized case in my Sendero is like having a marble rolling around in a pop bottle hoping to find its way out of the neck. What makes matters worse is that a FL sized case head spaces on the belt. A fireformed case headspaces on the belt AND the shoulder, and assuming that whatever rifle you are working with was reamed properly so the center line of the case and bullet is on the same plane as the center line of the barrel, the cartridge is locked in for its best possible accuracy. A good rule of thumb for reloading any case is to make as few changes to a fired case as is possible and still come up with a reloaded case that chamber well in the gun. Why FL size when neck sizing creates an absolute minimum of stress on the case, therefore making the case live longer, fit the rifle better, and be more accurate? This is a whole different topic, but another habit a lot of shooters I see at the range have is primer pocket reaming. They ream the primer pocket before each reloading and then wonder why their brass only lasts three or four loads before primers start falling out and they have an action full of powder. The new chemical brass cleaners are a Godsend for us reloaders because they completely clean primer pockets making a reamer an antique. If there was ever a process that the KISS rule applied to, it is cartridge reloading. But, as I have said many times on the forum, if it works for you, keep doing it.
Thank You for your detailed response.. It just works for me.
__________________
Silence is not a crime..
Reply With Quote
  #73  
Old 10-04-2013, 03:34 AM
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: South Africa
Posts: 24
Re: Full length resize or neck size only for y'all long range hunters?

Old Teacher youre saying that you never have to fl size and only necksize. Well then you must have some great reloading skills or a something perfect with the rifle. Brass flows with every firing and eventualy on the shoulders making it hard for the bolt to close. Thats why youre forced to fl size. I dont know how many times youve fired your brass to be able to say that you never have to fl size.

I got tired of doing necksizing and then being forced to eventualy fl size after couple of firings. So to keep things consistent now I body size after every firing. This only bumps the shoulders that small bit back to make closing the bolt easier but the case body still keeps its shape/dimensions of that guns chamber. And accuracy and poi stays the same whether necksizing only or using the body die. So now I only need 2 dies. Forster body die with neck busing of your choice and Redding competition seater.
Reply With Quote
  #74  
Old 10-04-2013, 11:40 PM
Silver Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 141
Re: Full length resize or neck size only for y'all long range hunters?

Most of my brass (all Nosler) is on its fifth or sixth loading. Brass cannot flow if it has no place to flow to. The only cases I full length size are my straight wall cases, my 45-70 and my 38-55. I have not full length sized a case for which I have a neck sizing die in recent memory, and I have never had a problem closing a bolt. I have had a problem opening one now and then, but that is a different story and a whole different problem. If I had a case that the bolt would not close on, I would throw it away, because full length sizing would create a case that did not fit the chamber anyway and I wouldn't want to bother wasting a primer, powder charge, and bullet to fire form a case whose life was near the end anyway.
Reply With Quote
  #75  
Old 10-04-2013, 11:56 PM
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: South Africa
Posts: 24
Re: Full length resize or neck size only for y'all long range hunters?

Only fifth or sixth firing let's see what they're like on the 10th. Btw what caliber are you loading?
Reply With Quote
  #76  
Old 10-05-2013, 11:50 AM
Silver Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 141
Re: Full length resize or neck size only for y'all long range hunters?

I have a number of cases that are on their tenth, or nearing it. The five or six I mentioned I meant as an average of all the calibers I shoot. I shoot about 15 different calibers ranging from the smallest, a 22-243 Middlestead, to a Remington .338 ultra mag, including several wildcats, my all-time favorite rifle, a semi-custom .257 STW. That's a fabulous caliber, and following the directions I got from the builder, I have fired about 500 rounds through it with no loss of accuracy. Fast cartridges will always wear out faster than slow ones, common sense tells you that, but there are things you can do to make barrel burners last a long time. My rifle builder said that I could expect about 2000 rounds through the .257 before I would start to see a serious loss of accuracy. The 22-243 will most likely not last that long due to the difficulty getting small bores squeaky clean.
Reply With Quote
  #77  
Old 10-05-2013, 11:17 PM
Silver Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: NW Florida Piney Woods
Posts: 228
Re: Full length resize or neck size only for y'all long range hunters?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Old teacher View Post
The 22-243 will most likely not last that long due to the difficulty getting small bores squeaky clean.
That's the first I've heard of that one... Hmmmm.... I'm not arguing but I wouldn't have thought that my .224" barrels were any less clean than my .308" or .358" barrels nor do they seem to take any more time to clean but I never really tracked that.
__________________
If it's long it can't be wrong... LDHunter (Long Distance Hunter) from the Piney Woods of NW Florida. I hunt clearcuts for scrawny whitetails... ;)
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes


Current Poll
Do you archery hunt for elk?
YES - 30.51%
54 Votes
NO - 54.24%
96 Votes
Not yet, but I plan to. - 15.25%
27 Votes
Total Votes: 177
You may not vote on this poll.

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:46 PM.


Powered by vBulletin ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Management Powered by vBadvanced CMPS
All content ©2010-2014 Long Range Hunting, LLC