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berger and no expansion?

 
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  #36  
Old 12-23-2012, 08:31 PM
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Re: berger and no expansion?

Quote:
Originally Posted by styngray32 View Post
I just experienced that same problem. Today is 12/23/12 and I shot and harvested a cow elk yesterday. I reload my 300 win mag to the following specs. Winchester brass, CCI primer, 73gr H4831, with the Berger VLD Hunting 168gr. I took the elk from 450 yards and hit it at the 3rd rib. It passed through the lungs and never passed through the other side. As I was skinning the cow I found it under the skin. I have the bullet now. I can send pics if anyone wants to see it. It never expanded. It looks almost new. Am I doing something wrong?
If you want..send pics to dwilkinson78@hotmail.com.

I will also post the pics on here if you want.
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  #37  
Old 12-23-2012, 10:06 PM
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Re: berger and no expansion?

Anyone gets pics of the bullet styngray32 found under the hide of his elk - please post photos here.
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  #38  
Old 12-23-2012, 10:55 PM
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Re: berger and no expansion?

I will post them when he sends it.
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  #39  
Old 12-23-2012, 11:12 PM
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Re: berger and no expansion?

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Originally Posted by scmacdon View Post
This is my first year using berger bullets. I was using 168 VLDs with a 300 win mag on a Moose at 425 yards. The bullet shattered his front shoulder and he fell down. Had to shoot him at close range to finish him off. I was shooting these bullets all summer out to 800 yards and was impressed by how they work. I have done lots of reading and was going to load some 210 VLDs with H1000 powder. I am not sure what to do now with all the posts of no expansion. I like the bergers but might switch to something else.
If you decide to switch every time someone gripes about bullet performance dont buy more than 1 bullet at a time. Bullet failure threads are very cmmon in this time of the year. All bullets do something weird sooner or later, even the pure copper, unobtanium computer designed death strikers.
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  #40  
Old 12-23-2012, 11:47 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2011
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Re: berger and no expansion?

Quote:
Originally Posted by toddc View Post
If you decide to switch every time someone gripes about bullet performance dont buy more than 1 bullet at a time. Bullet failure threads are very cmmon in this time of the year. All bullets do something weird sooner or later, even the pure copper, unobtanium computer designed death strikers.
I agree 100%
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  #41  
Old 12-24-2012, 03:43 AM
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Re: berger and no expansion?

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Originally Posted by Eric Stecker View Post
Mikeym1a,

Reports of no expansion are very rare but to say that it has never been reported isn't factual. It is very important to us that we get the specifics of this situation. I suggest that either you or the hunter you mention gets in touch with us directly so we can learn all we can. You can email me at eric.stecker@bergerbullets.com.

In the few reports we've received, we have been unable to get to the root cause of this result. This is primarily due to the infrequency of the occurances. Also, we have been unable to duplicate this result in our testing. Having said that I will offer some thoughts on potential causes.

Using Hunting bullets rather than Target or Tactical bullets (we don't make a 168 gr Tactical so that doesn't apply in this situation) is important. The thicker jacket used in the Target and Tactical bullets has proven to open up and fragment less than the hunting jackets.

Impact velocity is important. The lower the impact velocity, the less expansion and fragmentation will occur. Our Hunting bullets have been shown to open up at 1,800 fps which is low compared to many other options. The fact that you mentioned the range was 200 yards suggests that the impact velocity should have been high enough.

Trimming and repointing Berger Hunting bullets is strongly discouraged. You didn't mention that this was done but I wanted to mention it for others reading this thread. The size of the hollow point affects penetration and expansion. If the tip is repointed to be very tight, it can prevent or significantly reduce expansion.

I look forward to hearing from you so we can do all we can work toward eliminating this from ever happening.

Regards,
Eric
Eric something worth considering... .

While I cant' tell you I've seen this with the Bergers and I haven't shot enough of them at game to give any opinion BUT.

Something I have seen with other bullets regularly especially NBT's is that when impacting at high velocity a great many of them instead of NOT opening turn completely inside out with the base of the bullet then becoming the leading edge and if it did pass through gives the appearance of "no expansion".

Since so often bullets shot on game simply are unrecoverable I seriously wonder if the same is not occurring with the Berger's occasionally leading to the misperception that they had not expanded at all, when they'd done the opposite?

Have ya'll seen any of this with the target VLD's shot into media? Because I simply do not believe that so many of these bullets are not opening at all. The hollow point by design if anything leads to over expansion rather than under expansion in most cases.
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  #42  
Old 12-24-2012, 03:46 AM
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Re: berger and no expansion?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeym1a View Post
For the last 3 years my friend has shot his Elk and killed it each time with a 168 gr berger. Each time he tells me that the bullets had passed all the way through with no expansion and he had to track the Elk down. This year he had thought he missed because he watched the dust fly up from behind the elk, the elk took off and then about 200 yds away it collapsed. Upon seeing the Elk he realized that he did hit the Elk and the bullet had passed all the way through just as it had the other years, with no expansion. He doesn't load his own bullets, another guy does it for him. I've never had any problems like this. I use Berger bullets in 4 different rounds, they have always been perfect. Any ideas as to what is going on? Is this a common issue with Bergers?
Tell your friend that there are only two possible ways to have DRT kills every time and that is to one, hit the CNS directly, or two TWO fracture both shoulders sufficiently that they no longer function.

He either needs to aim better or hit his point of aim better. When you just punch the lungs more often than not the animal will run until it's lungs have filled with blood unless you leave a fist sized exit hole and sometimes even then they will run.

Head, spine, shoulders is the only way to drop them in their tracks every time.
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