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400gr X 416 Remington Mag NOT Enough For GRIZZ?

 
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  #15  
Old 05-02-2004, 02:24 PM
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Location: Palmer, Alaska
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Re: 400gr X 416 Remington Mag NOT Enough For GRIZZ?

I've shot plenty of hardcast bullets, a lot higher than 1200 fps too, never have seen any expansion in wet sand, any, and it's far harder on bullets than anything else ever is. So, I seriously have doubts about the claims of expansion with these 12ga slugs, but it isn't even necessary though, and likely counter productive for BB protection. That's why I use the 300gr hardcast's in my 44, and 310's in my 454, so they don't expand and get best penitration. They are already making over 40 cal holes in the critter (about like a high power expanding 30 cal) and need every bit of penitration they can get.

Still, the .750" - .900" holes the 416's and larger produce with expanding bullets at higher speed is a tremendous step up from a pistol or even a 30 cal rifle, no doubt.

John, aren't those energy figures for the 416 WBY just sick! Still haven't recovered a 400gr X bullet yet, but I haven't shot them through anything that had much of a chance at really stopping them either.

These 330gr HV BT GS Custom copper slugs I just got it sighted in with now are said to have a BC of over .550, so if they can be bumped up to 2900 - 3000 fps they should be outstanding at LR, or up close. [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]
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  #16  
Old 05-03-2004, 03:09 PM
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Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: North Dakota
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Re: 400gr X 416 Remington Mag NOT Enough For GRIZZ?

I read this over at AR the guide that shot the bear with a 416 said prior to him shooting the bear in the chest at point blank range the bear had been shot in the groin and the foot. He also stated that he short stroked his rifle and only got one shot in the bear when it charged him and that is the shot that the bear died from after he attacked the guide. That goes to show you shot placement is the most important thing hitting it in the foot and balls doesnt kill anything not even a deer let alone a Big Bear and I bet if he was able to get a second shot (But since he short stroked the gun jammed) the Bear Would have been done. A 416 with a 400gr Barnes will kill anything that walks the earth and stop anything you have to put it where it counts!!!
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  #17  
Old 05-03-2004, 05:41 PM
 
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Re: 400gr X 416 Remington Mag NOT Enough For GRIZZ?

Dakor, no wonder he attacked! If I was shot in the nuts, I'd attack too!

Even if the groin shot didn't kill the bear, do you think he wished he was dead?

I would!
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  #18  
Old 05-04-2004, 07:40 AM
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Location: North Dakota
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Re: 400gr X 416 Remington Mag NOT Enough For GRIZZ?

I hear ya I would have killed anything around me [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img] Like I said it is all shot placement!! I talked to the game and fish this it what they told me to use for Brown Bear nothing smaller than a 30/06 and nothing bigger than a 375 H&H. Now why would they send someone out there with to small of a gun? I told him about my 300 and the load I was using he said it would be fine. Gowge you have some cool pictures with that Rhino charging but why use a 10 bore when you can shoot them in the head with a 375 or 416? I mean if I had a Rhino or Elephant charging me straight on I would not be shooting at center mass I would shoot for there head one shot it is all over and there head is about the size of a Coffee table so it is not like it is small.
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  #19  
Old 05-04-2004, 09:41 AM
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Re: 400gr X 416 Remington Mag NOT Enough For GRIZZ?

Dakor, the brain of a Rhino is very small relative to the size of the animal - and it's protected behind a very thick skull. The elephant brain is not easily hit from the front at all - it's also a relatively small target - about 8" diameter. It doesn't offer an easy shot when the animal is amost on top of you. At the time of that 10bore brochure, there were NO .375s or .416s - it's from the H&H catalog of 1910-1912! [img]images/icons/wink.gif[/img]

The hunters of that era only had the .577s in a true big game caliber. The smaller calibers were basically just Express Nitro loads of old black powder rounds... I think we can learn a great deal by reading the old books by people like Sir Samuel Baker and others who went out there and killed countless Elephant, Tiger, Rhino, Lion, etc.

One thing that Baker wrote has stuck with me - and that's his comment that some hunters harbor a bit of "contempt" for the game which they hunt and don't use adequate guns for the task. They have nobody but themselves to blame when the animal turns the tables on them - and then, it's too late... A BIG Grizz is nothing to play around with - even average Grizzly are bad enough to kill you and eat you.

This said, the Ol' .577 Express did sling a very heavy 650gr solid slug at 1950fps! I think the new Dixie Slugs' hard cast PREDATOR 12ga (full bore) slug can be loaded to nearly this same velocity with modern components.

I wouldn't leave home without that big .375! [img]images/icons/wink.gif[/img]

GOOD LUCK & STAY SAFE IN ALASKA!

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  #20  
Old 05-04-2004, 02:42 PM
 
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Re: 400gr X 416 Remington Mag NOT Enough For GRIZZ?

"At the time of that 10bore brochure, there were NO .375s or .416s - it's from the H&H catalog of 1910-1912" I think we are in the year 2004. Bullets and rifles have come a long way since 1912. I think a 30 - 40 cal X bullet in the head will drop it if not kill it.

[ 05-04-2004: Message edited by: Harv ]
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  #21  
Old 05-04-2004, 07:47 PM
 
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Re: 400gr X 416 Remington Mag NOT Enough For GRIZZ?

Harv, my sentiments exactly!
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