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338 Raptor field test results, so far......

 
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  #15  
Old 11-14-2013, 12:31 PM
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Re: 338 Raptor field test results, so far......

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Originally Posted by Kiwi Greg View Post
In some parts of the country yes they can get heads that big.

Not around here though

We do get big bodied ones just not the heads, unless they have escapee blood in them.
I fear in the not to distant future, a pure blooded Stag will be a thing of the past. Already few have much interest in a NATURAL stag that does not score 400" plus. Same thing happening to the elk and whitetails in our country. Its becoming more business then tradition in my opinion which again in my opinion is sad.
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Kirby Allen(50)

Allen Precision Shooting
Home of the Allen Magnum, Allen Xpress and Allen Tactical Wildcats and the Painkiller Muzzle brakes.

Farther, Faster and Flatter then ever before.

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  #16  
Old 11-14-2013, 12:37 PM
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Re: 338 Raptor field test results, so far......

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Originally Posted by MudRunner2005 View Post
Yeah, looking back I wasn't very specific, but you hit the nail on the head, I was definitely talking about the Aoudad and the Red Stag.

I've always thought he Red Stags were cool looking, and I can imagine a hunt for one that size would certainly not be cheap. The Aoudad, as well.

I am interested in this .300 Raptor...As you know, we don't have much of a need for anything over .30 caliber down here, so the .300 Raptor might be right up my alley. Will it require a custom action, or can you remove some material from a 700 action for a 4.00" Wyatt's mag box and make it work? You have now officially piqued my curiousity.
To be honest, this stag would be considered relatively small by todays trophy standards. Most ranches that are serious about stags have mixed them with Rocky Mountain Elk and that's where you get the huge stags that go 400, 500 and even 600" of antler. Pure blood stags like this one are MUCH smaller but natural and that appeals to me much more.

They also tend to be less costly then the super stags so look around, you may be surprised by what you find in price.

The 300 Raptor will be the largest production 30 cal on the market when its finally proven and released. Best way to describe it, the case is the same diameter as a 338 Lapua but has a length that is the same as the 408 Cheytac. Its a monster. Will it be to large to be efficient with a 30 cal bullet, that remains to be seen but I can tell you right now, unless your shooting a bullet of at least 220 gr and more likely 230 or 240 grains in weight, it will really be a waste.

I will not build one on a Rem 700. It would likely handle it if built properly but I will not do it for liability reasons. There is a reason my Raptor receivers and 300 and 338 Raptor have the same name, they were all designed on paper at the same time, basically to get the absolute max performance level possible out of a conventional rem 700 footprinted receiver. They do this very well.

The 338 Raptor is simply to long for any current magazine system so its single shot only. The 300 Raptor may JUST make it into a 4.000" Wyatts mag, I have to see how that works out when I get the test rifle finished up and proven.
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Kirby Allen(50)

Allen Precision Shooting
Home of the Allen Magnum, Allen Xpress and Allen Tactical Wildcats and the Painkiller Muzzle brakes.

Farther, Faster and Flatter then ever before.

Web Page: www.apsrifles.com

allenmagnum@gmail.com
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  #17  
Old 11-14-2013, 12:41 PM
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Re: 338 Raptor field test results, so far......

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Originally Posted by clemens View Post
Nice shooting Kirby! What is the OAL of the Raptor series. Looking at pics I don't think a rifle that long would fit in my gun cabinet. Very nice rifle.
The Raptor LRSS in the pics has a 29" barrel length and is roughly 52" in length with a 13.75" LOP. My standard Raptor LRSS rifles have a 30" barrel length so they would be right around 53" in OAL.

My Raptor Stalkers generally have a 26 to 28" barrel length and small PK brake so they finish out in the 49" to 51" range or a bit less depending on LOP used on the rifle.

I do not offer the 300 or 338 Raptor chamberings in my Raptor Hunter rifles simply because they are designed to use 24-26" barrel lengths and in my opinion, the 300 and 338 Allen Xpress are MUCH better choices for that length of barrel, plus, they are much better for repeating rifles which the Raptor Hunter is generally always built around.
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Kirby Allen(50)

Allen Precision Shooting
Home of the Allen Magnum, Allen Xpress and Allen Tactical Wildcats and the Painkiller Muzzle brakes.

Farther, Faster and Flatter then ever before.

Web Page: www.apsrifles.com

allenmagnum@gmail.com
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  #18  
Old 11-14-2013, 01:26 PM
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Re: 338 Raptor field test results, so far......

Just wanted to add a couple pics of the two recovered Berger 300 gr Hybrid OTMs.

The bullet on the left was recovered from the whitetail and is a classic mushroom, could not ask for better expansion then this. Bullet on right was taken out of the Stag but this bullet had a much heavier resistance on impact so it did nearly loose its core but its still mostly there. In cleaning up both bullets, each lost around 20-25 grains of small lead pieces that were being held on by tissue.



This pic shows the bullet shank length after expansion, both were very similar in spite of very different impact locations, both measured between 1/2 and 3/4" in retained bullet length. Both also were between 1 and 1.100" diameter. Both retained well over 50% bullet weight and the whitetail was closer to 65% retained weight. For a match bullet drive to these velocity levels and with impacts at these ranges, not to bad in my opinion.

In my opinion, this type of performance is what you could expect from 338 Edge, 338 Lapua, 338 Allen Xpress class chamberings from 400 yards on out. With the larger 338 magnums such as my 338 Allen Magnum, you may want to make sure your out past 800 yards on very hard impacts but that is common with any match bullets in this chambering. Always critical to match your bullet to the range and game you will be hunting and from what I am seeing, I have total confidence in the Berger 300 gr Hybrid OTM for use in my 338 AX, 338 Raptor and 338 AM when used at appropriate distances for each chambering.

You hammer a bullet elk in his shoulder knuckle at 50 yards with a 338 AMs 3350-3400 fps velocity and you likely will have penetration problems. On the other side of the coin, you make a clean chest shot at 1500 yards with a 338 RUM or 338 Edge and you will likely see very little expansion. We need to keep a practical and realistic point of view concerning bullet performance as most bullet failures are not caused by the bullet but instead by those that chose to use the bullet in incorrect situations. We all have done it so not pointing fingers at anyone but for long range hunting, we must take some time to research results and also offer all the results we get in the field on different bullets, chamberings, ranges and game taken. Helps all of use dramatically to build this data base that we can all draw from.
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Kirby Allen(50)

Allen Precision Shooting
Home of the Allen Magnum, Allen Xpress and Allen Tactical Wildcats and the Painkiller Muzzle brakes.

Farther, Faster and Flatter then ever before.

Web Page: www.apsrifles.com

allenmagnum@gmail.com
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  #19  
Old 11-14-2013, 07:01 PM
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Re: 338 Raptor field test results, so far......

Near future, I'd like to try 338 Raptor for Canadian moose, up to 1200lbs.

The reason I want 338 Raptor is to shoot moose across large swamp which is about 1km to 1.8km long and over half km wide.

If the OAL of the rifle is around 53" including 4 port muzzle brake therefore the standard rifle case will not fit, correct? Do you use soft rifle case, similar to Voodoo?
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  #20  
Old 11-14-2013, 09:29 PM
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Re: 338 Raptor field test results, so far......

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiftydriver View Post
To be honest, this stag would be considered relatively small by todays trophy standards. Most ranches that are serious about stags have mixed them with Rocky Mountain Elk and that's where you get the huge stags that go 400, 500 and even 600" of antler. Pure blood stags like this one are MUCH smaller but natural and that appeals to me much more.

They also tend to be less costly then the super stags so look around, you may be surprised by what you find in price.

The 300 Raptor will be the largest production 30 cal on the market when its finally proven and released. Best way to describe it, the case is the same diameter as a 338 Lapua but has a length that is the same as the 408 Cheytac. Its a monster. Will it be to large to be efficient with a 30 cal bullet, that remains to be seen but I can tell you right now, unless your shooting a bullet of at least 220 gr and more likely 230 or 240 grains in weight, it will really be a waste.

I will not build one on a Rem 700. It would likely handle it if built properly but I will not do it for liability reasons. There is a reason my Raptor receivers and 300 and 338 Raptor have the same name, they were all designed on paper at the same time, basically to get the absolute max performance level possible out of a conventional rem 700 footprinted receiver. They do this very well.

The 338 Raptor is simply to long for any current magazine system so its single shot only. The 300 Raptor may JUST make it into a 4.000" Wyatts mag, I have to see how that works out when I get the test rifle finished up and proven.
Thanks for the info Kirby! Very informative. I am interested to see the .300 Raptor and it's performance abilities. I'd like to run a few of my wildcat designs sometime to hear your opinions on them. Who knows, might be a gold nugget in a bowl full of golden grahms. LOL
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  #21  
Old 11-14-2013, 10:37 PM
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Re: 338 Raptor field test results, so far......

Great Report Kirby,

Nice to see the Big Raptor doing well and developing. Congrats on the awesome trip to Oklahoma, too bad the Bucks were on the acorns. Awesome job on the details, its great you write & share so well what you have done for the LRH group here. Keep up the great work. Just getting settled in over in remote NW Montana, gonna be taking the 338 XHS out if it doesn't cloud and fog in too bad this weekend here.

Andy
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