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300 or 338

 
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  #15  
Old 08-22-2012, 10:12 AM
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Re: 300 or 338

Quote:
Originally Posted by DRG View Post
My belief:

.30 for under 1000

.338 for over 1000
This is good advice and we shoot both. The 300 win with a 210 is very good medicine for elk to 1000 and we have taken seveal good bulls. With the use of a 230 Berger I would maybe stretch it out to 1100 in perfect conditions. The 300 win picks up an additional 130 lbs of energy with a 230 over a 210 at 1000 yards and at this point the 230 becomes the faser bulet.

Beyond that it will be the 338 with a 300 gr Berger for me.

Jeff
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  #16  
Old 08-22-2012, 10:57 AM
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Re: 300 or 338

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Originally Posted by azsugarbear View Post
The big 338's cannot do anything at 1,000 yds that a 300 RUM cannot do just as well (except deliver more ft. lbs. of energy). Where the big 338's really shine is at 1,200 to 2,00 yds. At those distances, the differences are very noticable. The big 338's are more expensive to shoot, even if you reload yourself. So, unless you really need a big 338, I would stick with the 300 RUM.

I am currently in the process of gathering parts for a 338 Lapua improved build. Guess I can't take my own advice. :-)
Point taken, however if you go down the Lapua path you are orrect on the cost to reload. I have went the wildcat route .338 on the 300 RUM case that outperforms the 338 Lapua and the cost to reload is less. For example, brass for the .338 Lapua is $3/per cartridge vs. $.50 for 300 RUM.

The .338 RUM cartridge does not have the same case capacity as the 300 RUM.
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  #17  
Old 08-22-2012, 12:03 PM
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Re: 300 or 338

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Originally Posted by shepardsonp View Post
if you go down the Lapua path you are orrect on the cost to reload. I have went the wildcat route .338 on the 300 RUM case that outperforms the 338 Lapua and the cost to reload is less. For example, brass for the .338 Lapua is $3/per cartridge vs. $.50 for 300 RUM.
.
Sorry but I disagree, and so does internet pricing at midway on your brass prices.

First the 338 EDGE (338/300 rum) and 338 Lapua are almost identical in ballistics. But it you want to push the 338 LM in Lapua brass you have the option and it will out preform the EDGE by a very small margin. If you load them both to the max load of, lets say 92 gr of H-1000 with a 300 gr bullet the REM brass will start to have loose primer pockets at 3 or 4 firings. However the Lapua brass will be going strong for long after.

I just checked www.midwayusa and the cost of REM 300 RUM brass is $109 per 100. The cost of 338 LM is $280 per 100. So once you have tossed 3 sets of the "less expensive brass" and the LM brass is still going strong the LM has now become the better value. If you take into consideration the brass quality the LM wins hands down. So if you cull 20% of the REM now where are you?

Not sure where you got your info but I can tell you after owning both my statements are correct.

Jeff

References:

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/160...n-ultra-magnum

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/253...num-box-of-100
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Last edited by Broz; 08-22-2012 at 01:15 PM.
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  #18  
Old 08-22-2012, 01:09 PM
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Re: 300 or 338

Quote:
Originally Posted by azsugarbear View Post
The big 338's cannot do anything at 1,000 yds that a 300 RUM cannot do just as well (except deliver more ft. lbs. of energy).
To me this sentence kind of contradicts itself.
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  #19  
Old 08-22-2012, 03:23 PM
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Re: 300 or 338

Not exactly sure what you found contradictory about the statement, but perhaps I should have gone further with the thought process.

First of all, whether we are talking about the the 338 RUM, 338 Edge, or 338 Lapua - they all are ballistically pretty close to each other. So let's use the 338 Lapua to compare to the 300 RUM. Let's use the following as examples:

240 SMK @ 2,750 fps
230 OTM @ 2,800 fps
210 VLD @ 2,950 fps
200 AB @ 3,015 fps

The end result at 1,000 yds for each of the loads is anywhere from 20.5 to 23.5 MOA dial up for elevation. The hold-off for a 10 mph crosswind is either 5.25 to 5.5 MOA depending on the example used. Foot pounds of energy delivered at 1,000 yds ranges from approx. 1,250 ft/lbs for the 200 gr AB on up to 1,500ft/lbs for the 240 SMK.

The lapua loaded with a 300 gr OTM @2,750 fps requires 21.5 MOA dial up for elevation. With the same wind conditions, hold-off is about 4.5 MOA. These numbers are pretty much in line with the ballistics of the 300 RUM loads. No real advantage that I can see. Now when it comes to energy delivered, there is a real difference with the 338 Lapua delivering an est. 2,175 ft/lbs.

There has been a long-standing consensus in hunting/shooting circles that a minimum of 1,000 ft/lbs is necessary to kill an elk cleanly. It can be done with less, but for the average shooter, 1,000 ft./lbs is a good rule of thumb. With that in mind, any of the 300 RUM loads along with the 338 Lapua load, deliver substantially more energy than what is required. That's why I noted the ft/lbs delivered by the 338 Lapua as an exception.

So, from a ballistics point of view, the 300 RUM can pretty much do what the big 338's do. Additional energy is always nice - providing you can manage the recoil, but dead is still dead.
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  #20  
Old 08-22-2012, 04:49 PM
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Re: 300 or 338

Oh I understand what you were getting at, and I can run numbers through a ballistic calculator. I'm sure not calling you out or trying to start a fight, but just the sentence itself is like saying "it's the same thing, only different".
Sure the .300's can hang with the .338's as far as trajectory, but then again so can 7's and 6.5's. The dramatic difference is the size of the can-o-whoop-azz delivered on target. I've had a 7mag, .300mag and a .338 Edge and there is no comparison. The .300 kills but the .338 devastates. Most of the wound channels I would describe as horrific.
Try compairing my Dodge Dakota and my 4dr 4x4 Ram. Sure they will get you there, but it's not the same.
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  #21  
Old 08-22-2012, 05:07 PM
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Re: 300 or 338

Quote:
Originally Posted by azsugarbear View Post
So, from a ballistics point of view, the 300 RUM can pretty much do what the big 338's do. Additional energy is always nice - providing you can manage the recoil, but dead is still dead.
And I will add this is only true till the smaller calibers stat to peter out. There is a point where the 338 will not only shine in energy, but will also take over in ballistics and do it all with less drift.

Jeff
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