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264 win mag

 
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  #22  
Old 12-23-2009, 12:02 PM
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Re: 264 win mag

Paul Wright, also known as PJ Wright, worked for Roy Weatherby and designed their famous stocks their rifles had back in the 1950's. His target stocks were used on many rifles winning matches and setting records; I've got 4 or 5 of them and they are great. He often commented that he never made much monney off of competition stocks for high power competitors, but earned a living makin sporter stocks. PJ was also one of the USA's best long range competitors and's been on a Palma team or two.

In the late 1960's he showed me one of the single-shot solid-bottom (no magazine cut out) 9-lug actions Weatherby's shop made for him. It had a 6.5-300 Wby. chamber. PJ said its barrel made it to just short of 600 rounds when it died for accuracy. And that 9-lug receiver had problems like the round Remingtons holding epoxy bedding. Plus lapping all the lugs to full contact was a pain in the kazoo. He shot a lot better with hiw Win. 70's shooting .30-.338's and the like.
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  #23  
Old 12-23-2009, 12:22 PM
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Re: 264 win mag

Quote:
Originally Posted by OKIE2 View Post
Any one have any experince with a 30 inch 264 win mag rifle for
long range hunting or target shooting.
What kind of FPS did you get on the 85, 100 & 120 grain bullets?
What powders are getting the best accuracy?
Hello, I hope I can help you so that in the long term you stand to benefit from this advice. The .264 is the short magnum brass necked all the way down to 6.5. As such, if you are a gunsmith you may have some advantage when using this caliber because if you want prime accuracy, the only way you can make long range hits, you will be rebarrelling this cailber rifle every year. The bullets that the 6.5 utilizes for long range are the excellent 140 grain projectiles; anything less you are cheating yourself because the HIGH B.C. of the 140 grain 6.5 bullets are THE reason they dominate 1,000 yard rifle competition. if you want to shoot lighter grain 6.5 bullets for shorter range purposes, please do yourself a favor and shoot a much smaller cartridge that is capable of finite accuracy such as the .260 Remington and the excellent 6.5 x 284.

All the velocity advantage you may gain with the .264 Magnum case comes at the expense of throat erosion. Ten years ago I did some experimental work that involved necking down the .378 Weatherby cartridge to .22 caliber which had been done many years ago. Velocities reached 5,016 fps and we also recorded over 5 inches of throat erosion in just less than 80 rounds!

Velocity is fine, but at the cost of accuracy you gain nothing! If you really like to shot at longer ranges try the 6.5 x 284. There are very good practical reasons why it is so popular, plainly put, its better! When you take the short magnum case and neck it up just twenty thousandth to 7mm the throats ( the key to retaining both high velocity and finite accuracy) last a lot longer. This is also why the 7mm magnum is so much mor popular than the .264

I have used the 6.5 for hunting since the mid 1960's and wish I had a 6.5 x 284 all this time because I really believe its simply better than any of the others now that there is target quality brass and better bullets available.

Good luck and accurate shooting to you,

Gene So
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  #24  
Old 12-23-2009, 01:11 PM
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Location: east central fl. /n.c. pa.
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Re: 264 win mag

bart b. your comments on full legnth resizing are interesting. im not a paper puncher but have a number of friends who are. as a hunter, im committed to full legnth resizing all my loads. no doubt runout is a factor we deal with when sizing in this manor. im constantly being advised to just partial neck size in order to minimize runout. no doubt the expander ball is the culprit. ive started using o rings under the die and under the top lock nut. it helps, but dosent eliminate it enough. my question is, would not a minor amount of outside turning accomplish the same results as modifying the die?
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  #25  
Old 12-23-2009, 03:17 PM
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Re: 264 win mag

Yobuck, outside turning down of case necks might help a tiny bit, but I don't think the neck wall thickness should be less than 12/1000ths inch. That's 'cause standard chamber necks' diameters would allow too much expansion of the neck when the round's fired. More brass expansion from firing and contraction from sizing work-hardens the brass making it too brittle. And split necks are gonna happen soon.

Best thing I've ever done with full length sizing dies with standard necks and using an expander ball to get sized case necks reasonably straight was as follows. After depriming fired cases, I'd run their mouths over a good, stiff bore brush spinning in a drill press. I often used .270 bronze bore brushes to clean my .264 Win. Mag. case mouths; barrels, too for that matter. Two passes of the mouth over that brush removes virtually of the powder residue and makes the brass inside the neck smoother.

After those cases have now been tumbled or vibrated clean, their mouths are much cleaner and smoother. That means the expander ball won't have cruddy, rough powder fouling to resist its passage up through the sized down case mouth when the ram lowers. Necks so cleaned tend to be straighter than uncleaned case mouths coming out of the die. It helps if the expander ball is very smooth; polishing down a .270 expander ball down to the diameter of your .264 ball will help, too.

Last edited by Bart B; 12-23-2009 at 06:04 PM.
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  #26  
Old 12-23-2009, 09:55 PM
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Posts: 61
Re: 264 win mag

If you have a good chamber and headspacing is right you can neck size your brass, but if the head spacing and chamber are sloppy or if your press has a problem you will have to full size. A bad press can make the necks bad even if you fuill size.
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  #27  
Old 12-24-2009, 07:35 AM
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Re: 264 win mag

Quote:
Originally Posted by vanders View Post
If you have a good chamber and headspacing is right you can neck size your brass, but if the head spacing and chamber are sloppy or if your press has a problem you will have to full size. A bad press can make the necks bad even if you fuill size.
I ain't hijacking this thread, but the most accurate belted magnums I know of, including my own, have all shot the most accurate with new cases or twice full length sized fired cases; regular full length die (neck lapped out to 2 or 3 thousandths smaller than loaded round neck diameter, no expander ball) first then a pressure ring die to size that ridge immediately in front ot the belt back to new case diameters. All in standard SAAMI dimension chambers, tight custom chambers and often sloppy factory rifle chambers. Note there's only a 2/1000ths spread between GO and NO-GO headsapce on H&H belted head space gages.

What problems could a press have that requires full length sizing dies be used instead of neck sizing ones?
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  #28  
Old 12-24-2009, 01:12 PM
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Posts: 61
Re: 264 win mag

Will guys I hope your shooting times are all good and and you find this site very helpful because I see no reason for me to continuie replying. I tried a couple of times to help with negative results. I will remove myself now and good luck!
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