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See a wolf... what would you do?

 
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  #99  
Old 02-07-2012, 05:39 PM
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Re: See a wolf... what would you do?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dogdinger View Post
"I really wish people like yourself would read stuff before they put things like this on a website" -topgun

Ditto....... this is as bad as Peta and their scare tactics. I live about 15 miles from the Baca NWR. there has been a discussion about how to manage the elk/bison population going on for a while now. when dealing with the feds, you have to cross all the T's , so there was one line in a multi page report that mentioned large predators. this refuge was all private property until just about 3 yrs ago, owned by the nature conservancy,(anti hunters) who donated it to the NPS.....for some $$$ considerations. there is a resident herd of as many as 5K elk , depending on the time of year, and a few "feral" bison. the hunters around here are squawking pretty loud about the DOW using this as their private hunting preserve and not allowing the public access. this would disburse the herds just fine, but alot of the ranchers/farmers dont want this because guess where the elk would go? This is in the same general area where there has been a nearly year-round hunting season/damage control hunt with vouchers on private land. it is a shame to see elk being culled in the middle of the summer when their horns are not even fully developed.

there is very little chance the discussion about wolves here will go any further. AJ
dogdinger,

Give us the complete lowdown on the situation down there would you? I'm trying to wrap my head around issues being brought up regarding SFW/BGF and the Baca debacle. Help me out, would you? I don't want to be supporting something I shouldn't be.
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  #100  
Old 02-07-2012, 07:53 PM
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Re: See a wolf... what would you do?

jmden,
as i said, i dont think this discussion about wolves will go any further. the reporter did read that line in the report that stated that this must be considered and started the firestorm with the article.this is only a few thousand acres of farming land here in the center of the san luis valley, surrounding by more farm land and several small towns. if ever there was a place NOT to have wolves, this is it. the only reason the elk are there is just the fact that they have found themselves a nice little spot with plenty of feed and water and no hunting pressure, so they moved in. BGF picked up on this from the news article and ran with it as if it was a done deal. Now they will probably claim credit for stopping something that never was gonna happen. AJ
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  #101  
Old 02-07-2012, 10:24 PM
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Re: See a wolf... what would you do?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dogdinger View Post
jmden,
as i said, i dont think this discussion about wolves will go any further. the reporter did read that line in the report that stated that this must be considered and started the firestorm with the article.this is only a few thousand acres of farming land here in the center of the san luis valley, surrounding by more farm land and several small towns. if ever there was a place NOT to have wolves, this is it. the only reason the elk are there is just the fact that they have found themselves a nice little spot with plenty of feed and water and no hunting pressure, so they moved in. BGF picked up on this from the news article and ran with it as if it was a done deal. Now they will probably claim credit for stopping something that never was gonna happen. AJ
OK. Thanks for the further clarification. I hate to see BGF lose credibility, but it would appear from you and topgun in this thread that they may have blown this out of proportion. I hope you are right and wolves won't be considered, but on the other hand, I sure don't like that what has appeared to be an organization fighting to control wolves adequately is losing credibility.

It seems to me that BGF is still at the forefront of fighting for true wolf management. Would you agree or not? Would you feel comfortable at this point supporting BGF in its apparent efforts? Why or why not? If you don't feel comfortable answering this here, PM me, would you?

Jon
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In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. Genesis 1:1

"And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are the gift of God?" Thomas Jefferson - Notes on the State of Virginia

www.wildsidesystems.com - Shelter for Your WildSide - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tYwgo...&feature=g-upl
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  #102  
Old 02-07-2012, 11:06 PM
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Re: See a wolf... what would you do?

Glad to hear that what I stated was backed up by dogdinger who lives right out there! If I might answer from my perspective again, I believe that both the BGF and SFW have lost all credibility with what they say they are doing or have done and what is actually the truth. They intentionally told everyone that they were in favor of the rider that finally got wolves delisted when they were trying to kill it behind closed doors. Then when they couldn't do it and it passed, they took credit for that. Just as dogdinger mentioned at the end of his post, BGF will probably now say they got this wolf introduction stopped in the Baca when it wasn't even talked about other than that one sentence. Even if it was intended it would take years of government red tape and yet Ryan Benson has cried wolf in his email and outright stated in it that wolves would be introduced into the Baca this year. How much more does anyone need to see that these groups are an overall detriment to us, even if they are doing a few good things here and there?
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  #103  
Old 02-08-2012, 12:37 PM
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Re: See a wolf... what would you do?

I hate to say I told you so, but it didn't take long! Here is the latest release from Ryan Benson/BGF claiming exactly what dogdinger and I stated yesterday and that is that BGF would claim they were instrumental in stopping the wolf introduction into the Baca! If either BGF or SFW are such a force, doesn't it seem odd that Benson had to get this out of a newspaper and wasn't directly contacted by USFWS if they were the ones who got what wasn't even on the table stopped? What a farce!!!

Here it is:

Folks,
A letter was sent from US Fish and Wildlife Service clearly explaining that NO wolves will be introduced into Colorado's Baca National Wildlife Refuge or other portions of the San Luis Valley. It appears that this letter hit the Colorado press on February 6, 2012.
It's amazing what can happen when sportsmen get ahead of the curve and take action on important issues affecting wildlife. Supporters of Big Game Forever sent over 15,000 messages to members of Congress and the administration expressing their concern about Option "C" that would include the possibility of using Wolves to manage elk on the refuge. Thank you for taking the time to express your concern regarding the idea of introducing wolves into Southern Colorado.

Here is a copy of the letter from USFWS published by the Grand Junction Daily Sentinel on February 6, 2012:

Wolves will not be reintroduced to San Luis Valley
There has been some recent speculation that the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service intends to reintroduce wolves in the San Luis Valley to help manage elk and other species. It is important to set the record straight, the service in fact has no plans and no intent to reintroduce wolves in the valley.

The confusion about the service’s intent arose from a draft plan to manage overabundant elk populations affecting vital wildlife habitat on the San Luis Valley’s National Wildlife Refuges. The draft plan references a suggestion by some members of the public that the service consider wolves as a potential management tool.

By law, the service is required to analyze the comments and suggestions we receive. We do not, however, believe that wolf reintroduction is the appropriate management strategy for this area. We have instead put forward three other options including public hunting, which we believe will help ensure that the wildlife refuges in the San Luis Valley continue to provide high quality habitat for elk and other species — as well as recreational and economic benefits for local communities.

We encourage members of the public and our partners to review and comment on this important draft plan as we work to finalize it over the next two years. We’re committed to ensuring that the San Luis Valley’s land, water, and wildlife remain the pride of Colorado and the nation for years to come.

STEVE GUERTIN
Regional Director, Mountain-Prairie Region
U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service
Denver
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  #104  
Old 02-08-2012, 01:03 PM
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Re: See a wolf... what would you do?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Topgun 30-06 View Post
I hate to say I told you so, but it didn't take long! Here is the latest release from Ryan Benson/BGF claiming exactly what dogdinger and I stated yesterday and that is that BGF would claim they were instrumental in stopping the wolf introduction into the Baca! If either BGF or SFW are such a force, doesn't it seem odd that Benson had to get this out of a newspaper and wasn't directly contacted by USFWS if they were the ones who got what wasn't even on the table stopped? What a farce!!!

Here it is:

Folks,
A letter was sent from US Fish and Wildlife Service clearly explaining that NO wolves will be introduced into Colorado's Baca National Wildlife Refuge or other portions of the San Luis Valley. It appears that this letter hit the Colorado press on February 6, 2012.
It's amazing what can happen when sportsmen get ahead of the curve and take action on important issues affecting wildlife. Supporters of Big Game Forever sent over 15,000 messages to members of Congress and the administration expressing their concern about Option "C" that would include the possibility of using Wolves to manage elk on the refuge. Thank you for taking the time to express your concern regarding the idea of introducing wolves into Southern Colorado.

Here is a copy of the letter from USFWS published by the Grand Junction Daily Sentinel on February 6, 2012:

Wolves will not be reintroduced to San Luis Valley
There has been some recent speculation that the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service intends to reintroduce wolves in the San Luis Valley to help manage elk and other species. It is important to set the record straight, the service in fact has no plans and no intent to reintroduce wolves in the valley.

The confusion about the service’s intent arose from a draft plan to manage overabundant elk populations affecting vital wildlife habitat on the San Luis Valley’s National Wildlife Refuges. The draft plan references a suggestion by some members of the public that the service consider wolves as a potential management tool.

By law, the service is required to analyze the comments and suggestions we receive. We do not, however, believe that wolf reintroduction is the appropriate management strategy for this area. We have instead put forward three other options including public hunting, which we believe will help ensure that the wildlife refuges in the San Luis Valley continue to provide high quality habitat for elk and other species — as well as recreational and economic benefits for local communities.

We encourage members of the public and our partners to review and comment on this important draft plan as we work to finalize it over the next two years. We’re committed to ensuring that the San Luis Valley’s land, water, and wildlife remain the pride of Colorado and the nation for years to come.

STEVE GUERTIN
Regional Director, Mountain-Prairie Region
U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service
Denver
Just got that myself.

I guess I'm just still not completely convinced of your perspective, but it is certainly something I will keep in mind and has, unfortunately in a way, raised my index of suspicion. But, regardless of what we all think, I hope a vibrant discourse will help us all get closer to the truth.
__________________
In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. Genesis 1:1

"And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are the gift of God?" Thomas Jefferson - Notes on the State of Virginia

www.wildsidesystems.com - Shelter for Your WildSide - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tYwgo...&feature=g-upl
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  #105  
Old 02-13-2012, 10:37 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2012
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Posts: 132
Re: See a wolf... what would you do?

I would swear it was self defense!
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