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Mil-spec what does it mean, is it the best?

 
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  #8  
Old 05-15-2012, 03:52 PM
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Re: Mil-spec what does it mean, is it the best?

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Originally Posted by Kevin Thomas View Post
The problem (or one of them) with the Colt is that now that you want to upgrade it, you're faced with limited availabilty of certain parts due to their idiotic large pin lowers. Several of the better triggers out there are offered in small pin versions only, and that's one of the key components in making a rifle shoot to begin with. Another is the hard chrome barrel, which is also called for in most mil-spec applications. Fine for durability and longevity, but a real killer for accuracy. I don't want a piss-poor shooting barrel that lasts a long time. That's a problem for me. Chrome moly or SS, fine, but NEVER hard chromed. I see a lot of the true believers on that AR website insisting on CHF barrels these days too. In reading their posts, it's painfully obvious that most don't have a clue about the "whys" of CHF barrels, or what they will or will not do. Again, Mil-Spec, but not needed or wanted for some applications.

Continue the Mil-Spec crusade if you want, but a lot of us who understand the term simply have no need for such requirements.

Iím a believer thatís for sure and I donít think colt does large pins on the new stuff but I could be wrong had a few of their old rifles didnít care for the large pins myself? All my rifles are mil spec and they all shoot great. If I was building a match rifle I would upgrade to a high end barrel.
Iím might not be the moron you guys think I am. I have owned all the guns you are mentioning and I wish there had been someone to steer me on the right course from the beginning. The fact still remains that there is a huge difference in quality whether the quality is in the parts or the care taken when assembling the weapon and function checking before it leaves the factory.
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  #9  
Old 05-15-2012, 04:15 PM
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Re: Mil-spec what does it mean, is it the best?

No name calling involved here, and wouldn't have stood for it anyway. You're fine, you just might want to tone down the flaming on other people's choices just because they don't match what you might choose.

I'm currently sitting on (I think) about five match grade Service Rifles, which include any number of non Mil-Spec parts. I've run these to four MO State Championship titles, earned my Distinguished Rifleman's badge (#1366) and made the President's Hundred. I've been a firing member of the MO State Service Rifle team for many, many years and have missed a total of one Camp Perry Nationals in the past 20 years. I did my time in an infantry unit, successfully completed sniper school, won a Division Championship and was a firing member on an All Army Championship team while on active duty. After that I served as a cop in SoCal for several years, and kicked my fair share of doors in the process. Been involved in a few shootings, and am still here to talk about it. I still serve as a CMP/AMU instructor, and worked for several years teaching SDM courses to active duty troops about to deploy. Point is, I've been there, done that, and have several tee shirts to show for it. Aside from the fact that they weigh about 14 lbs, I wouldn't hesitate to use any one of those "match" rifles in a serious situation. They're every bit as reliable as anything the miliitary ever put in my hands, and at $2000-$2500 apiece, certainly aren't what I'd call "hobby guns."

Different things for different reasons, but there's never much to be gained by denegrating other people's hardware. I have nothing against Mil-Spec designations (and actually do look for it in some parts), I'm not a slave to it by any means. Just a suggestion . . ..
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  #10  
Old 05-15-2012, 04:24 PM
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Re: Mil-spec what does it mean, is it the best?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin Thomas View Post
No name calling involved here, and wouldn't have stood for it anyway. You're fine, you just might want to tone down the flaming on other people's choices just because they don't match what you might choose.

I'm currently sitting on (I think) about five match grade Service Rifles, which include any number of non Mil-Spec parts. I've run these to four MO State Championship titles, earned my Distinguished Rifleman's badge (#1366) and made the President's Hundred. I've been a firing member of the MO State Service Rifle team for many, many years and have missed a total of one Camp Perry Nationals in the past 20 years. I did my time in an infantry unit, successfully completed sniper school, won a Division Championship and was a firing member on an All Army Championship team while on active duty. After that I served as a cop in SoCal for several years, and kicked my fair share of doors in the process. Been involved in a few shootings, and am still here to talk about it. I still serve as a CMP/AMU instructor, and worked for several years teaching SDM courses to active duty troops about to deploy. Point is, I've been there, done that, and have several tee shirts to show for it. Aside from the fact that they weigh about 14 lbs, I wouldn't hesitate to use any one of those "match" rifles in a serious situation. They're every bit as reliable as anything the miliitary ever put in my hands, and at $2000-$2500 apiece, certainly aren't what I'd call "hobby guns."

Different things for different reasons, but there's never much to be gained by denegrating other people's hardware. I have nothing against Mil-Spec designations (and actually do look for it in some parts), I'm not a slave to it by any means. Just a suggestion . . ..
Kevin
You and I have spoken through PM many times I know who you are and I would never doubt that anything that came out of your mouth was not the truth. I value you opinion more than most on here. As for the guy I flamed we spoke via PM as well he works for a 3 letter group and his personal rifle is an LMT. I have just personally had and seen to many guys have their rifles break and its almost always due to them not buying from a company that at least guarantees the standard. If you make a part that exceeds the standard then thatís great.
Jon
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  #11  
Old 05-16-2012, 07:25 PM
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Re: Mil-spec what does it mean, is it the best?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin Thomas View Post
The problem (or one of them) with the Colt is that now that you want to upgrade it, you're faced with limited availabilty of certain parts due to their idiotic large pin lowers. Several of the better triggers out there are offered in small pin versions only, and that's one of the key components in making a rifle shoot to begin with. Another is the hard chrome barrel, which is also called for in most mil-spec applications. Fine for durability and longevity, but a real killer for accuracy. I don't want a piss-poor shooting barrel that lasts a long time. That's a problem for me. Chrome moly or SS, fine, but NEVER hard chromed. I see a lot of the true believers on that AR website insisting on CHF barrels these days too. In reading their posts, it's painfully obvious that most don't have a clue about the "whys" of CHF barrels, or what they will or will not do. Again, Mil-Spec, but not needed or wanted for some applications.

Continue the Mil-Spec crusade if you want, but a lot of us who understand the term simply have no need for such requirements.

Kevin,

You are right and the point you made here is why I started this post, so people would know milspec is not the best and there are better products out there than milspec. If someone has x-amount of money to spend on a gun they dont need to get milspec if they want the best.

Thank you for your post.
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to do violence on their behalf." -- George Orwell --

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Know the line has held, your job is done.
Rest easy, sleep well.
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  #12  
Old 05-17-2012, 05:21 PM
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Re: Mil-spec what does it mean, is it the best?

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Originally Posted by Cordell View Post
Kevin,

You are right and the point you made here is why I started this post, so people would know milspec is not the best and there are better products out there than milspec. If someone has x-amount of money to spend on a gun they dont need to get milspec if they want the best.

Thank you for your post.
I know this whole thing was directed at me so I want to be clear I never intended it to mean it was the best but only a base line from which you should start and not go below.
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  #13  
Old 05-18-2012, 12:54 PM
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Re: Mil-spec what does it mean, is it the best?

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Originally Posted by ICANHITHIMMAN View Post
I know this whole thing was directed at me
No

just got a bur in my butt one night and posted it. I have got questions from others in person and and now I can direct them to a place (and one of my favorite sights) that covers the topic with other people giving advise other than myself.
__________________
"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night
only because rough men stand ready
to do violence on their behalf." -- George Orwell --

Rest easy, sleep well my brothers.
Know the line has held, your job is done.
Rest easy, sleep well.
Others have taken up where you fell, the line has held.
Peace, peace, and farewell... --Unknown--

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  #14  
Old 05-18-2012, 12:58 PM
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Re: Mil-spec what does it mean, is it the best?

How the hell do i make a post on here I have a question about muzzle brakes. Can't seem to figure out the site it doesnt say in FAQ. I seem to be the only one with this problem, sorry to post this on a random thread. HELP!!!!!!
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