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12ga,10ga,8ga,4ga FH;585HE/700HE, other Big Bores--

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Unread 03-10-2012, 01:40 PM
Junior Member
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Michigan
Posts: 23
Re: 12ga,10ga,8ga,4ga FH;585HE/700HE, other Big Bores--

Holy Cow! A side by side .20 gauge slug gun!
I once asked a local gun shop owner if anyone had done this and he thought I was crazy! That is So awesome!
I'm amazed at the level of knowledge here, and all this info!
I'm hooked
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  •   #44  
    Unread 03-10-2012, 05:59 PM
    Silver Member
    Join Date: Sep 2006
    Posts: 315
    Re: 12ga,10ga,8ga,4ga FH;585HE/700HE, other Big Bores--

    Connecticut Firearms makes new ones for
    4-5 grand. kinda custom work 20ga for slugs.. Ed
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    Unread 03-25-2012, 04:21 AM
    Silver Member
    Join Date: Sep 2006
    Posts: 315
    Re: 12ga,10ga,8ga,4ga FH;585HE/700HE, other Big Bores--

    The sabots we are working with, take at least 15 different
    58cal cast slugs for good fit, with the OD measurement of
    sabot at .733" with all of them in. There are 5 Dixie
    Gunworks MZ slugs, 6 slugs from Lyman moulds I know of.
    Five slugs from Lee moulds.These are mainly muzzleloading
    slugs and can be cast varying hardnesses.

    Examples-58cal (.575"- .578")
    Lee molds for 500gr, 460 gr, 350gr, etc, slugs
    Dixie Gunworks slugs of 440gr, 375gr, 490gr, etc, weights.
    Lyman 530gr, 510 gr, 460gr, 400gr, 315gr, etc.
    And they are all good slugs at a saving especially
    when folks cast their own.

    I'm getting out info on these to see if any reloading
    suppliers will try to get some made, so we will have a
    quality, proper OD size sabot, to reload with.

    From the research on sabot patents and testing by various
    of our readers, the sabots can't be undersize, or accuracy
    at high speeds isn't possible. I get questions about how
    to reload them for accurate fast loads in plastic cases
    for regular hunting and target use. Have to tell them we need
    to have proper OD size sabot.. Most want sabot loads and not
    fullbore cast....Why; they want lighter for less recoil in
    regular weight guns, they figure smaller slugs cheaper,
    they won't have leading with sabots if using cast, don't
    have to lube and don't need gas checks if cast, cast slugs
    for sabot use cheaper than jacketed. These parameters cover
    a lot of shotgun only deer hunters trying to afford doing
    their own loads, trying to be as accurate as expensive
    factory sabot stuff and hoping the savings will allow much
    more shooting.In the 1st is 440gr 58cal Dixie, and second,
    one I like better a 510gr from Lyman mould. Third slug from
    a Lee 460gr 58cal mould. 4th is various 58cal slug ideas.
    Behind are Lyman and Lee 58cal molds. Got more coming of
    different 58cal weights, clear down to 315gr. My casting
    friend will get them and as soon a we get somebody making
    the sabot, he can aid the cause by making slugs.
    Some of the Lyman and Lee slugs are more streamlined than
    modst big bore rifle bullets as you can see in picture.

    Here is picture of a nice Armi San Marco 20ga break action
    we found, that we're testing loads in. I really like
    the style of this gun. I'm going to have extra barrel setup,
    an extra heavy 585cal barrel and put my long 585HE in it,
    to go along the other 585HE single shots 585HEs we have
    setup on NEFs, and CBCs.

    Here is a picture of nice Greener Martini 12ga, with new stock,
    and a heavy rifled bull barrel, a fellow redid.
    Such great work. And very accurate. All these guns need like
    all singleshots, including break actions, are heavy barrels
    and they shoot great and are easy to shoot with the
    extra weight.

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    Unread 04-06-2012, 01:44 AM
    Silver Member
    Join Date: Sep 2006
    Posts: 315
    Re: 12ga,10ga,8ga,4ga FH;585HE/700HE, other Big Bores--

    Here are a couple high speed, stop frame photos, showing how well
    and even these sabots we want to get made, open up.
    The petals being thinner with 58 cal bullets or slugs, opens easy.
    The slots between petals, going into the base aids even opening.
    We know a couple retailers that are interested in selling these
    style of sabots, if they round up the money to get the
    aquipment setup. Shooting supply companies are down some
    due the economy.

    Third is the 585 HE project, using a Savage 110-112 bolt action.
    Shown with barrel threaded and screwing action on.
    And the action is long enough to make a single stack mag, if we
    want, that would feed, with a little work, our 585 HE long case.

    4th & 5th; pictures are of a old time 20 gauge, double slug and shot
    gun that was priced little less than the big name English ones.
    It is a Husqvarna double. Nice gun, we'd really have fun with modern
    20ga slug shooting using this ..Ed

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    Unread 04-18-2012, 06:30 PM
    Silver Member
    Join Date: Sep 2006
    Posts: 315
    Re: 12ga,10ga,8ga,4ga FH;585HE/700HE, other Big Bores--

    Some info we have found out about the operation of discarding sabots.
    In first picture you see thin white line between the strong powder
    and the sabot. It is the white fiber cushion wad pressed flat. It is
    shown on the left in second picture. In the picture of it compressed
    you see it is pushing squarely on the sabot. This is most important
    wheh the sabot and slug exit barrel to get the slug started as
    straight as possible for accuracy.

    Other types of plastic cushions aid in sealing and help get best
    velocities but the rolls and legs in them can allow them to side shift
    which can affect how straight the sabot is on exit, thus causing the
    slug to deviate. The gray sabots we tried had cushion on the bottom
    of them and inspecting them after firing you could see they were pushed
    sideway some of the time. That is why we are trying to get tight
    fitting simple sabots built and recommend using heavy plastic seals
    with fiber wads to have least deviation and best accuracy.

    Third picture is our steel block we are using for 2bore
    with breach hole we got EDM'd into it.

    Fourth picture is an old time Kynoch rounds called the
    "Lethal" and the "destructor".

    5th picture is a H&H underlever double 8bore.I think it is rifled
    barrels.....Nice beautiful old gun.Ed

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    Unread 05-06-2012, 01:19 AM
    Silver Member
    Join Date: Sep 2006
    Posts: 315
    Re: 12ga,10ga,8ga,4ga FH;585HE/700HE, other Big Bores--

    I think we found good overall sabot design that will
    be the easiest to get made, easiest to get seals
    and whatever wads needed... Keeping design simple.
    It is same simple design as the ones pictured above
    but with slightly thicker base.It is fairly compact
    for more room for our slow powder loads, and when
    using slower powders, we don't need as much cushioning
    which makes the room for the powder. Larger charges
    of slower powder, better velocity with less case
    expansion, and more reloads possible.

    We hadn't tested soft lead 58cal slugs in 12ga sabots
    for penetration until now.. They did very well,
    two different 440 gr ones, going though 4 inch dried
    timber, pushing out some wood on the back.
    Shows they are just starting to expand.Should do great
    for deer and hogs. Going 2200 in long barrel NEF.
    Have pictures later. A 58cal slug at good speed is
    nothing to look down on. Many African hunters liked
    that caliber in their 577 doubles for big game.
    Slugs can be loaded faster, cast heavier,
    and cast harder for any need.And compared to other
    way of getting slugs out of a shotgun, once
    we have good fullbore sabots, we save on needing
    bullet lube, gas checks, cheaper to get, no barrel
    leading, much better BC in the same weight of slugs
    compared to short fullbore ones....

    Here are pictures of molds that can make cast
    58cal slugs for the 12ga sabot we are working
    on.There are many makers and brands and styles
    of molds and weights available.

    Here is picture of a 10ga wadcup with a 730gr hollowbase
    lead slug in on the left .In my heavy barrel 10ga smoothbore
    I got 6" group at 50 yds. If we made hollow in the base
    bigger it would be more accurate in smooth barrel.
    The slug is .69cal one,measures .686"(from Lymam mold
    like in picture), that Dixie Gunworks has. I bumped up the
    diameter about .015" --wadcup is BPI VP100.

    Here is picture of a nice 8ga double a fellow has.
    Great looking gun..Ed

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    Unread 05-12-2012, 07:55 PM
    Junior Member
    Join Date: Feb 2012
    Location: Michigan
    Posts: 23
    Re: 12ga,10ga,8ga,4ga FH;585HE/700HE, other Big Bores--

    I was tooling around online the other day and found these

    Barnes® Banded Solid

    Could this be used to load for a .20 gauge projectile?
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