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12ga,10ga,8ga,4ga FH;585HE/700HE, other Big Bores--

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Unread 11-22-2012, 10:44 PM
Junior Member
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Michigan
Posts: 23
Re: 12ga,10ga,8ga,4ga FH;585HE/700HE, other Big Bores--

Happy Thanksgiving!
Fantastic guns! The latest BPI catalog arrived recently and has me really wanting to load for my 220. The loads/components you've shown have been a big help. Seeing the .58cal. bullets in the Commander wads made the lights come on! For a loader I'd like one of the old Lee Classic kits in .20ga that you use a small mallet with. I Could use it to build loads right at the range. That would save on time driving back and forth. The only re-loading experience I have is with one of these in 30-06 and found it very efficient.
Thanks again for all this great information!
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  •   #65  
    Unread 11-23-2012, 12:29 AM
    Silver Member
    Join Date: Sep 2006
    Posts: 320
    Re: 12ga,10ga,8ga,4ga FH;585HE/700HE, other Big Bores--

    Another good deal to use at the range if you want to size cases
    back to better than factory, is a MEC Super Sizer. with 20ga collets in it.
    You can put any gauge collets in same MEC. This sizer is so much better
    than dies you force cases into, Just mount it on a piece of 2x8
    couple ft long.

    And the great reason I promote 58cal slugs, .575- 578" size, for 20ga
    wads is, we will use them in the new 12ga accutip type of sabots
    we are getting made soon, and I use in my 585HE long case. the .585"
    ones, for target and lighter game and fun shooting with less recoil..
    Kinda standardizing a variety of guns to use one diameter of
    economical slugs... Ed
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    Unread 12-06-2012, 05:00 AM
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    Join Date: Sep 2006
    Posts: 320
    Re: 12ga,10ga,8ga,4ga FH;585HE/700HE, other Big Bores--

    First is picture of the 8ga Falling Block with texturized paint finish
    on the stock. It enhances the grip quite a bit on hard recoil guns.

    Second is the Greener that I have my 585 HE in.Also have
    12ga barrel for it..

    Third is Magtech singleshot action that I'm experimenting
    with putting on a thumbhole stock.

    Fourth are the long bmg bulleted blank cases that I found, to use to
    make my 700HE Long case, 4.27" long. I have few extra sets of
    five in links like shown, extra to sell 5 at a time in links,
    if some need them for their collections, etc... Ed

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    Unread 01-02-2013, 07:59 PM
    Silver Member
    Join Date: Sep 2006
    Posts: 320
    Re: 12ga,10ga,8ga,4ga FH;585HE/700HE, other Big Bores--

    In our research to find economical and easy to use setups to load
    various slug/sabot combos in 12, 20 and other gauges, you've
    seen what we are doing with 58cal slugs in 12ga accutip type sabot we
    are getting built, and 58cal slugs in 20ga BPI Commander shotwad.
    You've seen pics of group shot by Ajay 58cal in 20ga Commander wad.
    And Greg Sappington made 16ga HP slug that fit 12ga BPI CSD wad.
    CSD wads are little thicker. In that vein we found another 20 ga combo
    that uses the BPI 20ga CSD wads and larger diameter of the 54cal
    muzzleloading slugs. Wad is thick and short so we can get the
    volumne of our slow powder we want in the loads for higher speeds.
    And base of CSD 20ga wad is thicker and stronger than most wads.
    . It doesn't have built on cushion, doesn't need cushion, which is not
    needed for slow powder loads. Has a good built on powder seal.
    It is long so it can be cut to fit any 54cal slug length.
    Best 54cal slugs to use are .543" and up.
    There is .548" Sharps style 2nd in picture from Dixie Gunworks.There is
    54cal Great Plains in picture on left, Far right in picture is 550 Magnum
    jacketed bullets in 20ga CSD. Great for hogs, bear. There are a variety
    of 54cal slugs you can cast or buy. Not big number like 58cal, but enough
    to find good simple combo. Shot 3" group with 54cal Great Plains in
    CSD at 30 yds, smooth bore. 380gr going over 2000 fps.
    Second picture shows they even work and fit good in 20ga RMC brass.
    Fits in a brass case real tight with .548" Sharps style slug in picture..

    Third picture shows how we mono-block 585HE barrels into strong
    singleshot break actions. Done it in NEFs, CBCs, Pedretti, Beretta,
    and the Magtech 199 shown above.

    Fourth picture is the O/U Tristar with 585HE on top and 3.5" 12ga bottom.
    We sleeved the top barrel with .585" ID sleeve. We will use it with
    the 58cal .585" Minie hollowbase slugs. Bottom just for shot loads
    with a interchangeable chokes. Ed

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    Unread 01-15-2013, 02:02 AM
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    Join Date: Sep 2006
    Posts: 320
    Re: 12ga,10ga,8ga,4ga FH;585HE/700HE, other Big Bores--

    Little work on non-discarding 12ga sabots,You can get SPW
    wads without slugs in them and we set up one for a light load.
    We put a 20ga Lyman in some and they stay together ok. Just
    shorten the bottom skirt of Lyman and bevel the bottom corner.
    Total weight sabot and all is 360gr,,Shown In the picture..
    We also shrunk the skirt of the 12ga Lyman cast slug and put it
    in 12ga SPW wads and total about 550gr. If you have Lyman
    12ga mold, can use it as pattern to make a slug to go into a
    SPW wad. Leave the top part same as original Lyman and make
    bottom so it fits in the SPW with real tight fit.

    I like to use P14/M17 Enfields for our testing. Great for my 585HE
    case and in picture it shows how we change the sear spring to one
    on the back of the sear. So we can open up the bottom to feed
    the long cases from singlestack magazine box by removing the
    unneeded front of the sear and metal above it in the bottom, giving
    room to the back, for cases that are 3.9" plus overall loaded length.

    Couple guys who are setting up 585HEs in singleshots are going
    to shoot 58cal Minies and other bullets and use black powder
    and/or substitutes. So I tested some with Pyrodex pellets,
    Used 54cal, 60gr equivalent and they stack in the case ok,
    and just beveled corner of bottom one so it set tight to the base.
    As the case has good inside radius. Used 3 pellets with 24ga
    card over pellets, 3/8" felt wad and another card with 440gr Minie.
    There is a certain nostalgia about all that sulfur smell.If you can
    stand the cleaning. Slug going 2100.. 4 pellets about 2400.

    Here is picture of another long bullet in sabot/wad , in 12ga that
    was sent to me. Ajay on Shotgun World put these together.

    Did some testing, 12ga plastic & brass with new super slow RE-33 powder.
    It fires off ok in 12ga with 700gr and heavier slugs, with shotgun primers
    like RE-17 which is much slower than shotgun powders. .
    It is made the same way as RE-17 as far as how the rate of burn
    deterrent is put into the powder. Which is why it ignites in large diameter
    cases like 12ga and BMG with shotgun primers. Really be great for super
    heavy 1100 to 1500 grain slugs to get good speed and keep case damaging
    peak pressures down. Example in 3.5" Fiocchi 12ga plastic case, 690gr slug in
    BPI Helix Driver Wad with 180 gr RE-33 the basecup only expanded .002".
    And they are thinner basecup than some..Ed
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    Unread 01-19-2013, 09:11 PM
    Silver Member
    Join Date: Jun 2002
    Location: middle Tennessee
    Posts: 388
    Re: 12ga,10ga,8ga,4ga FH;585HE/700HE, other Big Bores--

    Ed, I loved reading about you and Rob's exploits in the "Big Bore" section on AR, and now you are here! Been wanting to make a 8 Bore myself. GOSH! We only live once!
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    Unread 01-20-2013, 08:08 PM
    Junior Member
    Join Date: Feb 2012
    Location: Michigan
    Posts: 23
    Re: 12ga,10ga,8ga,4ga FH;585HE/700HE, other Big Bores--

    I have to agree, these are some awesome posts! All the information and pictures are greatly appreciated!
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